Shooting at a target if...

[johnnyspys]

Lets see if I can get the situation correct:


AA xxxxxxxx
AA YYYYYYY

X and A are player 1's lines and the Y line belongs to player 2. Neither player one or player two's battle lines are in close combat (less than 1/2 inch next to each other).

The Question: Player 1's A line are gun units. Can he shoot at me given that x in right in front of him, although a bit further away than my units. If so he is skirmisher would he get two dice?

[marioslaz]

Lets see if I can get the situation correct:


AA xxxxxxxx
AA YYYYYYY

X and A are player 1's lines and the Y line belongs to player 2. Neither player one or player two's battle lines are in close combat (less than 1/2 inch next to each other).

The Question: Player 1's A line are gun units. Can he shoot at me given that x in right in front of him, although a bit further away than my units. If so he is skirmisher would he get two dice?

It's not clear.
If A is facing downside IMO not
If A is facing right, then the answer is yes, but the number of dice cannot be judged. Right file of A can shoot (I'm assuming A is facing right, as previously mentioned). Left file can shoot if you can draw straight lines from both front corner of shooting base to a single point of target base without pass through friendly troops. With your scheme I cannot judge if left file can shoot or not. If last condition is satisfied 2 dice, otherwise only 1.

[stenic]

There is a section in the rules on priority targets that explains the options and order they should be considered.

Steve P

[johnnyspys]

There is a section in the rules on priority targets that explains the options and order they should be considered.

Steve P

I am sorry but that section is not clear about whether the target can shoot if their own troops are in the area. There are other war games where this cannot happen and I am trying to get a verification. If you have the page number that says otherwise I would be glad to have it.

[johnnyspys]

Lets see if I can get the situation correct:


AA xxxxxxxx
AA YYYYYYY

X and A are player 1's lines and the Y line belongs to player 2. Neither player one or player two's battle lines are in close combat (less than 1/2 inch next to each other).

The Question: Player 1's A line are gun units. Can he shoot at me given that x in right in front of him, although a bit further away than my units. If so he is skirmisher would he get two dice?

It's not clear.
If A is facing downside IMO not
If A is facing right, then the answer is yes, but the number of dice cannot be judged. Right file of A can shoot (I'm assuming A is facing right, as previously mentioned). Left file can shoot if you can draw straight lines from both front corner of shooting base to a single point of target base without pass through friendly troops. With your scheme I cannot judge if left file can shoot or not. If last condition is satisfied 2 dice, otherwise only 1.

Yeah the HTML does not do a great job keeping the lines the way I wrote them. I will try to do my best explaining. A are jannisaries with guns facing east towards Y. There is about a one inch gap between them and Y and about a one inch and one base gap with X....in other words Y extends further West than X (I realize the post did not keep the proper placing of my original preview before I posted it). X and Y are less than 1/4 inch apart (It has been awhile since I played the game and I thought everyone had to be one inch away if they were not within close combat but my opponent said no). So x and y are very close together. The rules state that if you can draw a straight line between the front corners of the based but I am not looking for whether X is in the way of Y. The question is can A fire into Y given the short distance of X and the fact that X is also right in front of A? This game does not allow for people to fire into close combat (for fear of hitting your own people), but it does not state if you can draw a hard 65 degree "straight line" to the target either. There really is very little language about arc of fire when your own troops are not in the way (blocking site) but are in the path of the fire.

Please, could responses include the section and some detail beyond "it is in the book"

[pcelella]

I don't have my book with me, so I can't quote chapter and verse, but the rules do say that for a base to target another one, a line has to be able to be drawn from BOTH front corners of the shooting base to the target base without being interrupted by friendlies.

I hope that helps.

Peter C

[johnnyspys]

I don't have my book with me, so I can't quote chapter and verse, but the rules do say that for a base to target another one, a line has to be able to be drawn from BOTH front corners of the shooting base to the target base without being interrupted by friendlies.

I hope that helps.

Peter C

It helps to a point. Do the lines have to be extending forward or can they be at an angle (severe angle 65 degrees)? In other words do both lines have to be drawn forward or can the lines take a 65 degree angle to hit X.

[pcelella]

The lines have to be straight, but they can be drawn at any angle.

Peter C

[marioslaz]

With your farther clarifications IMO "A" can fire. About fire and melee, keep in mind you can also fire to bases of a BG in melee if those bases are not giving dice to melee (facing enemy or fighting as overlap in 1st or 2nd rank). You can shoot also, I suppose, to 3rd or 4th rank of a BG even if those ranks are giving PoA (pikes).

[ShrubMiK]

>Do the lines have to be extending forward or can they be at an angle (severe angle 65 degrees)?

The question of whether the target is within the valid arc of fire is also dealt with on p82...just before the section that talks about drawing lines from both front corners to the target.

[johnnyspys]

>Do the lines have to be extending forward or can they be at an angle (severe angle 65 degrees)?

The question of whether the target is within the valid arc of fire is also dealt with on p82...just before the section that talks about drawing lines from both front corners to the target.

Thanks for all the help. The issue for me is not the arc as much as the thematic aspect of shooting at enemy targets that are very close to your own troops (less than 1/4 inch) and only one base further east (further away) than my line.

[gozerius]

As long as you have clear line of sight to your target, without passing through friendlies, and it is within your shooting arc, you can shoot. The only limitation on shooting near your own troops is you can't shoot through them, and you can't target any enemy base that is providing dice to a melee. If you can't find something preventing shooting at enemy near friendlies, it's because there is no such rule. Unless you are on a hill and trying to shoot over friends, then you have to have at least 1 MU between shooting bases and friendlies, and enemy cannot be within 1 MU of friendlies being shot over.

[hazelbark]

As others have said and you have suggested, it appears you are bringing other rules baggage that dont apply

[petedalby]

Also remember that the bases are representative only.

[hammy]

Also it helps to keep the rules simple.

If you can't shoot at a base that is near a friendly BG what happens if the enemy are near you? That means you need to find exceptions and that increases complexity.