Battlefield: Europe MOD v2.4

[Barsbay]

Just started playing this - looks fantastic! Quick question regarding reinforcements, as I am still on the Poland scenario should i go ahead and reinforce units and do upgrades on the map, or will there be a chance to reinforce and upgrade more cheaply between scenarios, or at some other point. If it makes no difference I may as well start on the Poland map.

Also, is there a point to having the Gneisenau on this map? Or is it just there for historical flavour?

[PeteMitchell]

On the four pre scenarios I would only reinforce what is really needed to win

[Barsbay]

Ok, thanks. For some reason I thought all the units in Poland would carry on to Barbarossa in the state they were left at the end of the Poland scenario. Now I realise only the core 5 units carry on, and you get a chance to reinforce and upgrade them between scenarios.. thanks again.

[McGuba]

In the first multiplayer match between HerzogSieg (Axis) and Duedman (Allies) the activation of the besieged Leningrad forces changed the dynamic in that sector.
The Axis did not prepare for it happening, since he played BE for the first time to this point. The besieged pocket was treated as a reliably static situation until then.

Of course the mod is supposed to be played in single player at least once before attempting a multiplayer match, which is much more difficult if played against an experienced opponent.
Also in the next version there will be more information given about such things in the message boxes.

As for more randomness with the Minsk and Kiev pockets, i.e. potentially making a few Soviet units in these to activate and go on the offensive early on under some circumstances, I am not so sure it would be a good idea. Historically the Soviet forces near the border in June 1941 were in a fairly bad condition, lacking fuel, ammunition, spare parts, with at least half of the tanks having mechanical problems due to wear tear and lack of adequate maintenance, making many of them unable to move, let alone go on an offensive. That's why the Germans were able to achieve great successes in the early days and weeks, destroying thousands of tanks and other equipment, while many others were destroyed by their own crews or were just simply abandoned.

I think it is pure fantasy to imagine some of these units suddenly decide to move towards Berlin to capture it. And even if they do, then what? It would not mean the end of the war, and there are quite a few German units in the rear which could deal with such a bold action and it would not really affect the Axis drive on Moscow.

The Kiev pocket is another story, it can be argued that perhaps it could be made a bit more difficult to encircle it on time and then they can activate as it did happen in a few single and multiplayer matches, with catastrophic results.

But I have already made it more difficult to reach Moscow early in the next version in both single and multiplayer versions and if I also make it more difficult to encircle the Kiev pocket then the whole operation would be a lot more difficult, if not impossible. So for now I think the added speed bumps to Moscow should be enough, just not too sure. And of course it also needs a lot of testing as Intenso rightly stated.

I want to try the option of UK first.
In the next version.

By the way is there an approximate timeframe when it will be available?

It is hard to say, although a lot has been done and I am very happy with it so far, it will still take some more time. Especially testing takes ages, unfortunately.

Also, is there a point to having the Gneisenau on this map? Or is it just there for historical flavour?

Yes, it is mainly there for flavour only. Mainly to show what (little) action Britain did to support the struggle of Poland in September 1939, i.e. the bombing of this ship after the British declaration of war with a few Wellington bombers. And basically that was all: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_betrayal#Poland

And yes, it is of course better to upgrade units between the early war scenarios than doing it on the map.

[PeteMitchell]

Would it be possible to keep the old download links, I.e. to previous versions?

[Intenso82]

It is hard to say, although a lot has been done and I am very happy with it so far, it will still take some more time. Especially testing takes ages, unfortunately.

Well I did start the UK first variant in the current version.
It's been a long time since the last attempt.
I don't know if I'll play through to the end though.

I am now a Strategist and Logistician)
I got more into the upgrade paths of the units, Also noticed the graphical changes, everything is great.
I think I was missing something earlier)

The idea to focus on the West.
Leave the Soviets at the end.

1941
In the East, do a limited operation.
In a "Hit and Run" tactic, but as part of a global strike.
Activate the Minsk Pocket, then divide Army Group North and Centre.
One part destroys the troops in the Smolensk direction and captures it,
the other part captures Gomel and activates the Kiev pocket.
Army Group South, clears the zone up to Kiev and activates the southern part of the pocket.
Odessa is also captured.
All units then leave Russia.
To avoid Winter penalties.
Winter is spent resting and refiting at home.

All in all, it all worked out,
a few units got a bit delayed and took some penalties, but most of them got out.
Due to some confusion at the border, some units got hit by the Winter Penalty)
One unit was very damaged and couldn't leave, went into partizan action, then went to join the troops)))
Overall this operation was like a Hollywood Thriller, very exciting.

The Soviets sent Lavrinenko on a T34 to crush the Axis, they managed to get Minsk back.
Lavrinenko's T34 at the end of 41 had 200 exp plus Hero bonuses, it was 1.5-2 times stronger than a normal German tank.
Too strong for my taste. But I understand the reasons for it(AI).

In general the Soviets have become more interesting in their use of Aviation including Old Aviation.
With the limited number of Axis fighters, it's an interesting action.
There have also been a few counterattacks by the Soviets on the central front near Smolensk, which is also very good.
Although the Soviets' aircraft are already very strong, especially the new Fighters which are not easy to hit, as well as Bombers which can do significant damage for 1 hit on a tank from 12 to 8-9.
That immediately turns off the Elite Tank Unit from the "Blitzkrieg clip"(

In the West
At the expense of the Eastern Front Malta has been strengthened and so everything is going well.
Africa was seriously strengthened, Tobruk was taken and good chances to capture Cairo and the whole Mediterranean coast.

As for the main thing, was made preparations for the capture of UK, tried the “old scheme” was a frontal strike through the strait, with isolation of the landing point by submarines.
But the coastal defenses were not completely suppressed:(

Well, the attempt failed.
Maybe we should try something different and reboot.

Maybe the frontal strike through the straits doesn't work at all now?
Yeah, I know about the lateral strike for landing, never got it to work.
I find it quite difficult to implement. Everything should work like an "English clock" any mistake, one turn delay, one very bad random and everything fails...

What successful ways have you used to land in England?
What options worked in MP?

[Intenso82]

[eskuche]

Are you interested in playing a MP match? I can't get any made anonymously to stick more than a turn..

[PeteMitchell]

Interesting but is the full retreat from Russia needed or do you lose a lot of turns due to the commute?

[Barsbay]

Another question regarding the preperation scenarios.. for me in the mediterranean scenario, I am finding it difficult to both get a decisive victory AND capture Tobruk and Mersa Matruh (which together with their airfields are 4 extra prestige locations) - is there any practical benefit (prestige or other) to winning a decisive victory? If not I think I will go back and use the extra turns to get the last locations for some more prestige and maybe a little more exp for my planes.

Thanks in advance, and thank you for the answers to my previous questions.

[PeteMitchell]

What turn are you at and how to you plan to continue?

[McGuba]

Would it be possible to keep the old download links, I.e. to previous versions?

Why?
I only have about 2Gb free space at my dropbox account so I cannot really have more than the latest version there since I use the same account to host the Turan campaign as well. And sometimes a few more things for personal use. Of course I could register more accounts to host the earlier versions but it would be a bit too much effort and I don't really understand why it would be necessary. Always the latest version is the best, the more we go back in time, the more issues, bugs, and missing features we will find.

Well I did start the UK first variant in the current version.
...

As always, it is very interesting to read about other players experiences with different strategies, so thanks for that!

I got more into the upgrade paths of the units, Also noticed the graphical changes, everything is great.

Thanks, and again, as always, the next version will have some more improvements in this regard!

Although the Soviets' aircraft are already very strong, especially the new Fighters which are not easy to hit, as well as Bombers which can do significant damage for 1 hit on a tank from 12 to 8-9.

Following your earlier suggestion I have already reduced the hard attack value of the Soviet tac bombers for the next version and it looks like a nice change so this should be a bit better next time. And there are of course many other things, but I do not want to get ahead of myself.

So yes, I do listen to feedback and if they make sense from a historical point of view and do not break the balance then they may get implemented sooner or later.

What successful ways have you used to land in England?
What options worked in MP?

It has been a long time since I last invaded England in single player. As usually I only test play the actual latest version while playing the historical path, which does not include a landing there.

But as I remember at least Duedman and goose_2 managed to do so in their latest youtube playthroughs, so maybe check those out. I am pretty sure Uhu did it as well, so you might as well ask him, and perhaps a few other guys also.

As for MP, I do not know about any MP games with a Sea Lion attempt, apart from our own match a few years back in time when I made such a bold move. It looks like most players go for the seemingly safer traditional path of invading the east. But I was also thinking that it would be interesting to play such a multiplayer match, only to see if it is possible at all to invade Britain in MP. But as you know as well, multiplayer matches take a long-long time, so... maybe some time later...

Another question regarding the preperation scenarios.. for me in the mediterranean scenario, I am finding it difficult to both get a decisive victory AND capture Tobruk and Mersa Matruh (which together with their airfields are 4 extra prestige locations) - is there any practical benefit (prestige or other) to winning a decisive victory? If not I think I will go back and use the extra turns to get the last locations for some more prestige and maybe a little more exp for my planes.

Currently a decisive victory at the Mediterranean Sea scenario means 500 prestige points, while a marginal victory means 250, if I am right. Perhaps the difference should be greater than that. As for capturing Tobruk and Mersa Matruh, I don't think it worth it in this scenario and in the big scenario they will be owned by the British again as of course historically these were not captured before 1942.

[Intenso82]

Interesting but is the full retreat from Russia needed or do you lose a lot of turns due to the commute?

To regain strength after Winter penalties I'm guessing will need about 1500 prestige (for green) - 3000 for mixed reps.

Are you interested in playing a MP match? I can't get any made anonymously to stick more than a turn..

No, I don't have enough time at the moment.

Also in the next version there will be more information given about such things in the message boxes.

By the way pls, remind me what approx % of units are reduced by
when capturing key Soviet points.
Moscow (I think it was 30%?), Leningrad, Oil Fields.
And also how will it decrease if you capture only Stalingrad, and C-cities?

Who knows if there is an increase in experience under indirect artillery fire? and what kind?

[Intenso82]

What turn are you at and how to you plan to continue?

Turn 20

I rolled back a few turns and replayed a few times.
Now landing in England from the side.
Initially only managed to land 3 units by sea transport, 1 was destroyed, +2 Airborne.
The landing of the rest had to be postponed for a while.
Until a safe zone was established and cleared of the enemy fleet.
The submarines did not have time to come up, but later they and aviation were able to destroy the enemy fleet.
Although several Kriegsmarine ships were stranded without fuel off the coast of England
When everything was already ‘under control’ and the rest of the first wave landing force was approaching the coast, suddenly 5-6 British Stategic Bombers struck and the losses began to mount.
Apparently they were going to bomb Germany but saw other targets on the way)

On 1942
On the map is the capture of Britain, Cairo.
In the East,
using the former Stalin Line, in the Minsk area.
In the South, occupation of the defence line on the Dnieper or beyond.....
Capture Sevastopol and create a safe zone on the Black Sea

[goose_2]

Hello McGuba,

I thought there was a scenario to play the mod at 1944 levels? I was going to give it a crack at that point in the war to see if I could have things change a little different than they happened in reality.

Where is that located?

[PeteMitchell]

Its under the saved folder in the mod files, when you unpack the zip

[Intenso82]

Beginning of ‘43

1. The Soviets have launched a major winter offensive.
Let's see how it goes.
In the south they have a long shoulder, stretched communications.

In the centre, troops hold the line near Smolensk.
In the north, artillery units began arriving to attack Leningrad.

2. The Black Sea has not been completely cleared of the Soviet fleet.
It can also be seen that a possible landing operation to advance to Baku oil is very complicated, only 2-3 free hexes for landing.
Therefore, the main troops are transferred to the Kursk-Orel zone.

3. In the west, it is planned to finish the capture of England,
and to repel the attack on Tunisia.
All chances for this are there.

In general, the Axis for 42 years is already exhausted.
Reserves and prestige have run out.

[Intenso82]

As for MP, I do not know about any MP games with a Sea Lion attempt, apart from our own match a few years back in time when I made such a bold move. It looks like most players go for the seemingly safer traditional path of invading the east. But I was also thinking that it would be interesting to play such a multiplayer match, only to see if it is possible at all to invade Britain in MP.

Yeah, it was an interesting invasion
But I don't think it's possible in the MP now.
Good thing it's still possible in the single player game)

A few thoughts and ideas.
1. How about a NoZoС trait for Tanks?
Then they could really be mobile troops and have the advantage of mobility.

Have any of the modders tried this yet?
I wonder how it would play out with that.
Although apparently it would have a significant impact on the balance of the game.

2. Naval movement
Over the course of the game, the thing that annoyed me the most was the fuel restriction for ships.
I chose Realistic+, but apparently it's too much for me.
So I've been bypassing it from time to time.

I had two ideas.
The first is an additional mode for all ships, which allowed ships to move but at a slower speed.
Or the second is to add generally all ships every turn 1-3 fuel.
Very often there is not enough fuel for a few hexes and for 1 turn =14 days you can refuel the ship or push on a tugboat))))
Otherwise, the ship is lost and you have to replay a turn or two...

3. Experience.
Looks like it would be interesting if in German cities added experience to units that are there. For example +3 per turn.
Also in German ports added experience for submarines, for example +5 per turn.
As you know in the Baltic was training of submarine crews.
Also in German airfields to add +3-5 experience for Aviation.
Then the training would be more natural.
The more time a unit is in Germany the more it is trained.

[Duedman]

I just uploaded the start of a new Multiplayer Letsplay versus McGuba in BE2.5 Beta.
This time it is with English commentary

https://youtu.be/7fiyUBapHP0?si=HhSqEb_nKqBUGcTy

Playlist:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... Ije2YpAlWX

McGuba added several interesting things in this version like railroad sections that only complete over the course of the scenario.
I will go over the list of changes at the start of the scenario.
Of course these additions are subject to change for the final version.

As usual there are no replays of the enemy turn and the start is rather uneventful for the Allies. Well.... they get hammered with not much to respond.
But once the Winter starts we shall fight back!

[Uhu]

The trick is to deal with the Balkan air force as soon as possible and move all your air assets to fight in Africa and at Crete.
With the additional air power you got the upper hand. But Tobruk cannot be taken, forget it. Mersa Matruh is already a bonus price.

Another question regarding the preperation scenarios.. for me in the mediterranean scenario, I am finding it difficult to both get a decisive victory AND capture Tobruk and Mersa Matruh (which together with their airfields are 4 extra prestige locations) - is there any practical benefit (prestige or other) to winning a decisive victory? If not I think I will go back and use the extra turns to get the last locations for some more prestige and maybe a little more exp for my planes.

Thanks in advance, and thank you for the answers to my previous questions.