MAP CHANGES thread - Suggest here

[Pocus]

Please post your suggestions on minor map changes here. It won't be possible to reshape the map, but if you see issues about:

Wrong Culture
Missing links between 2 regions
Weird terrain
Wrong name or city name

etc. then please post...

[JonJonJon]

I'll offer up making the port/harbour icons smaller. There's enough competition for real estate on the map with unit flags, cities and event icons and at their current size give a cluttered effect (Britain and Greece for example are a smorgasbord of them). They're almost as big as clickable news icons, yet they don't serve a purpose aside from showing a region has a port. I could live with them at half the size.

[Surt]

Antwerb should be some kind of mix of Dutch/Flemish/Frisian and not French.
Brabrant might have more dutchies and less French.
Luxemburg has in the last Century changed from German to French, but what was it in 1054?
Gelre - not French some mix of Germanic tribes?
West Frisia - Is that so much Franconian and so little Frisian?
I think Bremen and Slesvig should have some Frisians too and the latter also some Germans.
Are you sure Wien and Austria was so West Slavic at this time? Wikipedia suggest that at 1054 Germanization was well under way.

[PortoLover]

I think this falls under "reshaping the map", still... Pisa is a part of Tuscany not of Liguria. Liguria definitely needs that 3rd region for balance purposes though.

I believe there should be some Christian Orthodox in Sardinia (all 3 regions of the province). Sardinia was still technically a part of the Byzantine empire in the X century, and the local governments didn't really start warming up to the roman catholic church up until 1015-1016 when Pisa and Genova helped the locals defend themselves from an Andalusian invasion. Some Orthodox saints are still venerated today, it wouldn't be a stretch to imagine that there were still quite a few orthodox priests in 1050.

Sticking with Sardinia, I also think its regions should have fewer pops at the game start. The whole island numbered around 300k inhabitants at the time, and even today it barely counts a million. In game Cagliari has as many pops as Naples and more than Bergamo.

Cornwall should have more Breton culture. Maybe even majority Breton culture?

Dubh Linn should still have some Norse pops as their presence in the area is attested in 1171. Maybe the name of the city should also be changed to "Áth Cliath" as that's what the Celtic settlement was called?

All of the Celtic Independent Fiefdoms have "Celtic" as their national culture despite their regions actually having Irish/Scottish/etc cultures. I'm not sure what the consequences of that are, especially considering that the Independents are not "real" factions.

[PortoLover]

I'll offer up making the port/harbour icons smaller ... I could live with them at half the size.

I agree. When I first started the game I kept clicking them thinking they were interactive buttons

[nightleaf]

For now I only play byzantine and I must say it is pain to manage and develop provinces with 3 regions only and there are many of them when you play as byzantine.

In asia minor its hard to count them all and its very easy to get lost and it can happen every turn. Byzantine have 13 provinces with only 3 regions in asia minor and they are all connected so it will be easy to merge and adjust them.

There are 7 provinces with 3 regions on balkans and for example ragusa region can transfer to dioclea province and senj region to dalmatia province (dioclea 3, damlatia 4, croatia 6 ==>> dioclea 4, dalmatia 4, croatia 5). Province boulgaria have 8 regions and around it are 4 provinces with only 3 regions.

[Cubefox]

The Slovakia regions should be West Slavic. The state is West Slavic but the land is Hungarian, which is not right.

[Emp_Palpatine]

Antwerb should be some kind of mix of Dutch/Flemish/Frisian and not French.
Brabrant might have more dutchies and less French.
Luxemburg has in the last Century changed from German to French, but what was it in 1054?

I concurr.

Brabant should be flemish and so should be Antwerp.
Also, Calais should be mixed.
Actually, by that time, the linguistic border there between Romance languages and Low-Germanic -Flemish/dutch- was more southern than today and it went north during the Middle Ages and Modern era up to its current state.

[Emp_Palpatine]

Also, I don't know if this is currently adressed in the future patch (I remember something about this on Steam boards) :
- There should be christians, levantine armenians & greeks pops in the holy land and Egypt.
- There should be some christians minorities in Northern Africa.

[springel]

I admit that the Northern Netherlands were too fragmented in a typical HRE way to be truthfully represented in this game, but as a Dutchman interested in the Middle Ages I don't feel at home in the current representation.

Holland is the only playable power present in the area in the game, while the prince-bishop of Utrecht was its main adversary in the area and equally powerful. It ruled over large parts of the North-East of the Netherlands and had claims on parts of Frisia. It also fought on the Eastern border against Bentheim etc. in an area where I never encountered a Duke of Saksony in any of the sources playing any political role there.

In the game Utrecht has become the capital of Holland, which is heresy

[Surt]

Also, I don't know if this is currently adressed in the future patch (I remember something about this on Steam boards) :
- There should be christians, levantine armenians & greeks pops in the holy land and Egypt.
- There should be some christians minorities in Northern Africa.

Playing Fatimids, I can tell that all of Fatimiddistan is riddles with heretic Christians, didn't check the holy lands but I expect they are as bad.

[Nepos96]

Sicilian pops are described as multinational. Is this intended?

[Surt]

Sicilian pops are described as multinational. Is this intended?

They have been conquered by a lot of different empires recently.

Greek/Indigenous/Phoenician until 192(?) BCE but lingering on as Romanization takes hold.
Roman
Vandal (440)
Ostrogoth late 400s
Byzantine 535-827
The local Muslem emirate has just split up in many Taifa's, I think it was Byzantine before that.

"Western Sicily was overwhelmingly Muslim, and contained large plantations run by slave labor, often producing sugar.[59] Around 1050, the western half of Sicily was ethnically and culturally distinct from central and eastern Sicily. During this time, there was also a small Jewish presence in Sicily, evidence seen in the catacombs discovered on the island[61][62]

Palermo was initially ruled by the Aghlabids; later it was the centre of the Emirate of Sicily, which was under the nominal suzerainty of the Fatimid Caliphate.[citation needed] During the reign of this dynasty revolts by Byzantine Sicilians continuously occurred especially in the east where Greek-speaking Christians predominated."
-Wiki the sage

So you could say multicultural or split it in different pops of Arab, Germanic, Greek, Italian, one of each in each region, except the western which should be wholly Arab with slave sugar plantations.

[Cubefox]

Also, I don't know if this is currently adressed in the future patch (I remember something about this on Steam boards) :
- There should be christians, levantine armenians & greeks pops in the holy land and Egypt.
- There should be some christians minorities in Northern Africa.

There are plenty of Christians in Egypt, they are all Christian Heretic (Coptic)

[Pocus]

We will re-read, verify and try to implement many of the suggestions for changes expressed here for 1.02, no worries. We should be ok with the requests as long it is realistic, historical and not killing a specific gameplay feature.

[Beleg]

UI- area suggestion: change how provinces are coloured.

Overall UI of the game is extremely uneven. Great and truly immersive event pictures and decorations (kudos for artist!), tabs are okay-ish with its brown/gray palette, but these pink, bright yellow and seledine ownership-coloured map is nightmare. It really destroys immersion, as medieval times simply did not produce such colours, which are additionally displayed without any pattern, as plain, bright "table" (unless I missed some graphical options to switch it off). Basic mode of view of the map looks like disco esthetic from 70's.

I think best solution would be to make it look like other grand strategy titles- faction colours only being displayed along province borders. For FoG:E there was a mod once that change the same thing if I recall correctly.

[Tanaka]

Would it be possible to have an option for cities that are not see through like in the previous Empires game? The map looks so much better in the previous game the cities now look terrible...

[Pocus]

You mean the cities not tinted according to their owner? Yes, it's something that will hopefully be included in the 1.01 official release.

About the colors, @Beleg: The fewer colors you use, the harder it is to distinguish between countries. Using more subdued, medieval-ish colors would make the issue worse. If you only want to see colored borders with natural terrain colors, just click on the first filter (hotkey 1) and you are good. It's the same in Empires.

[Beleg]

About the colors, @Beleg: The fewer colors you use, the harder it is to distinguish between countries. Using more subdued, medieval-ish colors would make the issue worse. If you only want to see colored borders with natural terrain colors, just click on the first filter (hotkey 1) and you are good. It's the same in Empires.

Thanks for reply. Yes, filters are accessible, but as you wrote when they are on it is in turn difficult to differentiate between borders of various provinces, especially when zoom out a little bit. The best solution, and estetically apealing, would be to use thicker, coloured half-transparent border margins like the one in CK3 and/or make them fade away into inside of province. This way it's easy to tell what terrain belongs to whom:
(just for comparision, I know both games are different)

There was also hot discussion long time ago on Paradox forums in which direction UI of their new games should go ("old guard" preferred to have plain colourful mosaic of old type) but it turned out new system works great. It's both readable and not overbearing player with flashy palette. Perhaps a thing worth to consider for the future of FoGK, it would play splendidly with this mozarabic-inspired art.

[Sabaron]

I feel the Armenian region could use some work.

Vanand is the only country with Armenian culture and they start off ruled by Christian Heretics. Even if this reflects some historical reality, having an official religion of heresy is terrible. Your people have an Unrest modifier of 8 and Waldensian, Lollard, and Cathar revolts are constant. Please revert them to Orthodox; that is much closer to historical reality than making them all permanently angry heretics.

Syunik and Tashir are historically Armenian kingdoms that are listed as Georgian in-game, though their populations are 100% Armenian and their in-game descriptions talk about their status as Armenian.