SP's 3rd Medieval Invitation event

[ericdoman1]

Hi Pete

Just wondering if we should play this again but this time the nobles use the peasants armies at 450pts.

Possibly the armies we had were the strongest.

If so Anders and Chris I am OK with any option, except the French and the Danes:)

Cheers

[stockwellpete]

Table........................P.....W.....D....L......BP.....PTS
1. ericdoman1..............4.....4.....0.....0.......1......17.....Noble
2. hidde.....................3.....2.....0.....1.......1.......9.....Noble
3. davouthojo..............3.....2.....0.....1.......0.......8.....Noble
4. stockwellpete............5.....1.....1.....3.......0.......6.....Peasant
5. Fedem....................4.....1.....0.....3.......0.......4.....Peasant
6. Triarius..................3.....0.....1.....2.......0.......2.....Peasant

[hidde]

Reducing my embarrassment at the bottom of the table....

davouthojo (Low Countries) 21/38 vs 47/44 triarius (Danish)

The Danes kindly came out of their forest, and the pike wall proved strong enough

davouthojo (Low Countries) 27/38 vs 43/39 fedem (Ord French)

The Low Countries got off to an early lead, catching some of the retreating longbows.
But then the fight reached the Swiss and the French knights and bogged down.....fortunately the early lead made the difference in the slugging match.....

No elegance in this army!

Hrmph...out there bashing peasants while keeping your fellow noble waiting...how can that be?

[stockwellpete]

Hi Pete

Just wondering if we should play this again but this time the nobles use the peasants armies at 450pts.

Possibly the armies we had were the strongest.

If so Anders and Chris I am OK with any option, except the French and the Danes:)

Cheers

I wouldn't have said that really, Eric. I think the French Ordonnance and Medieval Germans are very well-balanced armies and the Danish can be balanced by adding German allies. I think that I would prefer the first two armies that I have mentioned to anything else in the competition. The Burgundian Ordonnance is a balanced list but the Maximilian and Swedish armies really need open terrain each time to prosper - they would be slaughtered by a top player using the French and German armies on crowded terrain. I just think that the skill gap between the very top players and those of us who are "quite good" is enormous.

[hidde]

hidde (Later Medieval Swedish) 24/33
davouthojo (Low Countries) 39/38

I'm up for a reversal, Pete. What about the nobles take 425pts?
French for me, the Danes to much like the Swedes.

[ericdoman1]

What about 200pts:)

[stockwellpete]

I'm up for a reversal, Pete. What about the nobles take 425pts?
French for me, the Danes to much like the Swedes.

OK then. I am quite happy to play again - it is medieval, after all.

So we have you, me and Eric. Let's see what Chris, Mike and Federico feel about it. I think the 425pts suggestion is a very good idea because it will help to further measure the handicapping scale. A 75pt difference between armies should roughly equal 3.00 difference in LOEG ratings between players. So if you look at the current ratings (upto LOEG Season 6), it should be the case that Eric will still be able to win his matches but Anders and Chris will be very vulnerable to Mike and hard-pressed by myself and Federico.

Nobles
ericdoman 7.91
davouthojo 6.95
hidde 6.34

Peasants
Triarius 4.67
stockwellpete 4.49
Fedem 3.59

I did play Eric in a friendly game a couple of weeks ago where he gave me 100pts (500 v 400) and he still won! I was the Welsh army and Eric had a Lancastrian army. The score was something like 34/43 to 49/45.

[stockwellpete]

Table........................P.....W.....D....L......BP.....PTS
1. ericdoman1..............4.....4.....0.....0.......1......17.....Noble
2. hidde.....................4.....3.....0.....1.......1......13.....Noble
3. davouthojo..............4.....2.....0.....2.......0.......8.....Noble
4. stockwellpete............5.....1.....1.....3.......0.......6.....Peasant
5. Fedem....................4.....1.....0.....3.......0.......4.....Peasant
6. Triarius..................3.....0.....1.....2.......0.......2.....Peasant

[ericdoman1]

I am for the 425pts thang.

Although the peasants will be successful this time methinks. I have a feeling Mike might feel a bit insulted:)

Playing Chris at the mo and it's about evens. My left is not looking so good but my right is. Especailly as a routed unit of Chris' blocked the chance for a knight unit to go crashing in agst som hw foot.

My game was won agst Pete as he pushed up too much on one flank where he was overwhelmed very easily. If he had pulled that flank back and joined in with the Welsh marching through the woods (his left flank blew me away). He would have won by a big margin.

[stockwellpete]

I am for the 425pts thang.

Although the peasants will be successful this time methinks. I have a feeling Mike might feel a bit insulted:)

Both Mike and Federico are better players than their current LOEG rating suggests, I feel. Mike should be 5.00+ and Federico should be the same as me around 4.50. But if you have a bad division in LOEG, where maybe you have experimented with your army, a run of bad results can do quite a bit of damage to your rating. Once that season drops off the ratings (after a year) then the player's rating will recover.

Playing Chris at the mo and it's about evens. My left is not looking so good but my right is. Especailly as a routed unit of Chris' blocked the chance for a knight unit to go crashing in agst som hw foot.

Can you ask Chris if he is up for a part 2 of this please, Eric?

My game was won agst Pete as he pushed up too much on one flank where he was overwhelmed very easily. If he had pulled that flank back and joined in with the Welsh marching through the woods (his left flank blew me away). He would have won by a big margin.

Exactly what I said to my second in command as we were legging it, "Bunch of flankers, this army is".

[ericdoman1]

It was the Frenchie fault. They must have known what was going to happen weekend gone. "Eh bien, you may beat uz in ze rrrugby but you will not ween today" (spoken with an outrageous French accent):)

[stockwellpete]

I have done the new ratings now and posted them in the LOEG forum. So for our little group the new values are . . .

Nobles
ericdoman 7.96
davouthojo 6.84
hidde 6.11

Peasants
Triarius 4.63
stockwellpete 4.48
Fedem 3.66

[FedeM]

My horse is still at the back. Secretariat maybe

[davouthojo]

I'm up for a replay.....can I have more flexible army next time?

Happy to have 425 points - in the spirit of LOEG ranking experimentation, how about:
Eric 400
Anders/Chris 425
Mike/Pete 500
Fedem 525?

Eric beats me 80% of the time - probably = 25 points. We can test this to find the point where winning is split 50-50 (I already reached this at 50 points vs Pete!) Though terrain and army match-ups are each worth at least 25 points each too. Interesting to have a self-adjusting handicap like golf - the more you win, the fewer points you get until you reach your rightful position.

[ericdoman1]

Whoa there

I know I may have beaten Pete (onlyjust though) and he had 100 pts less but he should have beaten me by a bigger margin.

As for me beating Chris 80% of the time. Umm if you look at our last few games. I reckon it is close to 50/50. With Hidde there isn't really much in it. I will go with 425 but not with 400. Fedem on 525!!! You are having a laugh, he'll walk it.

[stockwellpete]

I'm up for a replay.....can I have more flexible army next time?

Happy to have 425 points - in the spirit of LOEG ranking experimentation, how about:
Eric 400
Anders/Chris 425
Mike/Pete 500
Fedem 525?

Eric beats me 80% of the time - probably = 25 points. We can test this to find the point where winning is split 50-50 (I already reached this at 50 points vs Pete!) Though terrain and army match-ups are each worth at least 25 points each too. Interesting to have a self-adjusting handicap like golf - the more you win, the fewer points you get until you reach your rightful position.

I think we should just have 425pts (nobles) versus 500pts (peasants) next time, Chris. In that way it will give us a good little sample of matches around that level of handicap and we will be able to compare the two batches of results. We can certainly swap the armies around a bit, maybe the French Ordonnance or Medieval Germans would suit you better when we embark on part two? As soon as we complete the first tournament we can start the second one - I will PM Federico and Mike today and see if they are up for a re-match.

EDIT: we have five of us up for a re-match now. Just waiting to hear from Mike.

[stockwellpete]

I understand that Mike has serious computer problems at the moment so there will be a delay in his two remaining matches.

[stockwellpete]

Right, we have all six players now agreeing to participate in a 4th Medieval Invitation event where the handicap between nobles and peasants is 75pts (500 to 425).

Basically what we can do is swap the armies round between peasants and nobles so that Eric, Anders and Chris can choose from French Ordonnance later, Medieval German later and Medieval Danish later - and myself, Federico and Mike can share out the Medieval Swedes, Maximilian Low Countries and Burgundian Ordonnance.

There are still three games to finish in the current competition before we start though. Mike has matches against Anders and Federico and Eric and Chris also have an outstanding match. Once these three games are completed I will open up a new thread for the next competition.

[stockwellpete]

Can I have progress reports on the three outstanding games please? I know Chris and Eric are well advanced in their match but how about Mike's two games against Federico and Anders? Are they well underway? I would like to finish this tournament by next weekend so we can start the 75pt challenge next Sunday (which, appropriately for us peasants, is 1st April ).

[hidde]

My game with Mike have only had a couple of turns and no fighting.
Has been halted since Mike started having computer problems.