FORTRESS EUROPA - Game gamme stopped (RC9)

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:11 am

Aryaman · Post by **Aryaman** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:59 am

I think this match is not really a good indication of the strength of German defensive strategy, because Zechi has made several important mistakes, even after losing England the Allied player has a big chance of breaking the Axis in the East if he plays carefully, meaning waiting until winter for attack instead of losing forces in early attacks in summer.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:25 pm

Aryaman wrote:I think this match is not really a good indication of the strength of German defensive strategy, because Zechi has made several important mistakes, even after losing England the Allied player has a big chance of breaking the Axis in the East if he plays carefully, meaning waiting until winter for attack instead of losing forces in early attacks in summer.

I only need to hold Berlin and Rome for 1945... Do you really think i would intead to stay there? This strategy is not Iron,it can bend

Even if it would be you playing, i would still resist

zEchi is playing fine and well if you ask me.

Crazygunner1 · Post by **Crazygunner1** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:16 pm

It looks like a perfect time for "Mansteins miracle" has come on the southern russian front. I managed to launch a surprize counter attack after retreating the whole winter in a game recently. The entire southern russian front was surounded and destroyed

So i would suggest, put as many tanks and mechs as possible on clear ground between Lvov and Brest Litovsk. The goal with these units would be capture of Vinnitsa, it is the most important since he won´t be able to rail in reinforcements. Destroy as many units as possible but also just having zone contol on units is good enough to force a retereat by foot. Also if you can drive in a kiel in the frontline further south to impede retreat. Prefereably near Odessa where you got a cross over already. This will put him in a very bad situation one that is almost without any recovery.

For this to work you need to have some intel on what kind of forces he has behind what you see on the southern front, so yourself are not walking into a trap yourself, wich i doubt. He needs to move a bit more forward and make contact across the front to really suck him in.

It looks like you already had this in mind? You have a better force than i did, much stonger cause i did this in early 42 so you should be succsesful

Good luck, should be fun to see

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:28 pm

By the way, its early 1943...

As to what i have in mind, well, i do want to launch an offensive, but AFTER Zechi launches his. The whole point here is not to try and get Moscow, but bloody the russian nose enough so he cant go far in winter 43-44 and we can play terrain for time.

The way ive got my defense structured is simple. The whole southern front will give way mid 1944 if i have to to bolster german defenses thickness(we will see about that). Loosing Romania, Bulgaria and the south will not have any impact on victory conditions.

It will be very hard for Zechi to reach Berlin if there is a german corps in every hexe from Konisberg to Berlin...

As for offensive, i do, actually, have something in mind.

Zechi will give me my opportunity somewhere, either be in southern Russia or Vichy France, where he is actually looking at a landing. This should be interesting.

Crazygunner1 · Post by **Crazygunner1** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:39 pm

To be honest i think we are gonna see a total crush from the Axis. Allies won´t get anywhere at all. Germany is simply too strong and too much time has passed for them to adapt to this strategy.

You will probably be able to give both russians and the us a bloody nose. I simply can´t see how he can prevail here when in this situation. As you said you can also give much ground and do a fighting retreat.

Good job Max, this one is in the bag

gerones · Post by **gerones** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:48 pm

Aryaman wrote:I think this match is not really a good indication of the strength of German defensive strategy, because Zechi has made several important mistakes, even after losing England the Allied player has a big chance of breaking the Axis in the East if he plays carefully, meaning waiting until winter for attack instead of losing forces in early attacks in summer.

I kind of agree. IMO, Zechi should have avoided such high air losses in his finnish campaign. Those losses would have meant precious PP´s needed for building a really huge Red Army instead. But, as I have mentioned in another post, may be the loss of UK has made Zechi to be in a hurry with the soviets.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:59 am

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:52 am

Aryaman · Post by **Aryaman** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:19 pm

supermax wrote:
I only need to hold Berlin and Rome for 1945... Do you really think i would intead to stay there? This strategy is not Iron,it can bend Even if it would be you playing, i would still resist zEchi is playing fine and well if you ask me.

I consider myself just an average player, and I don take much time playing my turns so I am a bit careless, so probably you would have no difficulties resisting me

Still, I think Zechi has made some significant mistakes, I have not played against a German player using this strategy, but I have played as German with v.2.0 three times this strategy against competent PBEM players and they all did that same mistake, attacking too early. I think an Allied counterstrategy should be based on a silmutaneous attack to Italy and the Eastern front with as poerful a force as possible, and that can not be earlier than winter 43.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:01 pm

Aryaman wrote:
supermax wrote:
I only need to hold Berlin and Rome for 1945... Do you really think i would intead to stay there? This strategy is not Iron,it can bend Even if it would be you playing, i would still resist zEchi is playing fine and well if you ask me.
I consider myself just an average player, and I don take much time playing my turns so I am a bit careless, so probably you would have no difficulties resisting me
Still, I think Zechi has made some significant mistakes, I have not played against a German player using this strategy, but I have played as German with v.2.0 three times this strategy against competent PBEM players and they all did that same mistake, attacking too early. I think an Allied counterstrategy should be based on a silmutaneous attack to Italy and the Eastern front with as poerful a force as possible, and that can not be earlier than winter 43.

The name of the game here should be to try to overload me on many fronts. But his problem is steep. Everywhere he attacks i have a major air advantage and his air losses are more than too much.

And the fact of the matter is i am just about to be offensive again, which is going to be a problem for Zechi.

You will see it shall be interesting.

Crazygunner1 · Post by **Crazygunner1** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:01 am

Think there are 2 ways to do this....one is like you have explained, attack with a large force on several fronts. The problem with this is as pointed out, the Axis are simply too strong now so he won´t accomplish much.

The other one is, instead of letting max have his time to create a double line defense i think he should have been on the offensive right away after Max cleared out the frontlines trrops. Attack with mechs, inf and leaders attached to them in 42 That will cost some infantry but Russians can easily replace them. Have tanks in the rear to exploit any breakthroughs that you might have. Let the airforce rest and rebuild until they are powerful enough to challange the Luftwaffe, probably won´t happen until 43. I mean these russian guard units with leaders on are ferocious, sure you will probably loose some...

joerock22 · Post by **joerock22** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:21 am

This is why I recommended invading the Iberian Peninsula instead of Vichy France. Zechi could have established a large army in Portugal before giving the Axis a chance to intervene. Instead, he landed a small force in southern France and was obliterated. Max didn't even have to commit that many units to the area to do it. He would have had to send many more units to Spain to deal with a large Allied army pushing eastward.

Now Max is going to get Vichy resources for the rest of the game and the Allies have nothing but heavy losses to show for it.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:29 am

Well Joe, you've said it. A very stupid move on his part unless its a feint for something else...

But to his defense, there isnt much he can do against the german armor in 1943... I mean, even the Italians have developped organisation lvl 3 now, they have a large army and no losses since the start of the game (manpower for the italians is still over 85).

Now the Russians have given up a summer offensive (for the early part at least), and i am thinking of moving slowly westward to the next line of defense in the north (100% river) where i should stay for the rest of the game.

Looking at Zechi's prospects now, he must be looking at the map and wondering how he cannot run out of time... For sure i will keep Berlin and i have a very good chance of ending it with London, France, Berlin and Rome, thus having a real victory for the germans, not a pissy panty "resistance to the finish in front of Berlin" kinda 1945...

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:32 am

Crazygunner1 wrote:Think there are 2 ways to do this....one is like you have explained, attack with a large force on several fronts. The problem with this is as pointed out, the Axis are simply too strong now so he won´t accomplish much.

The other one is, instead of letting max have his time to create a double line defense i think he should have been on the offensive right away after Max cleared out the frontlines trrops. Attack with mechs, inf and leaders attached to them in 42 That will cost some infantry but Russians can easily replace them. Have tanks in the rear to exploit any breakthroughs that you might have. Let the airforce rest and rebuild until they are powerful enough to challange the Luftwaffe, probably won´t happen until 43. I mean these russian guard units with leaders on are ferocious, sure you will probably loose some...

I dunno Craz...

Doing an offensive in 1942 would have played right into my hands. First of all, its not like i wasnt rady for it, i had 6 TACS, 10+ FTR , 8 ARM and a ton of Mech and INF... Having the low-effectiveness Russian come at you in the 5-supply zone in the start of the war is almost a dream scenario for the germans, They would have been crushed and then it would be a realy party for the 3rd reich.

So Russians would have fought without air superiority, tanks needing to me railed to the front with low effectiveness, and germans at 100+ for most troops... AND with better techs.

Crazygunner1 · Post by **Crazygunner1** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:24 am

Maybe you are right...

But i still believe that you need to keep pressure becuase he is not gonna get anywhere now...not by a long shot. You probably have so much PPs to spend that you don´t even know what to build anymore

Allied player can never allow that to happen or you have lost the game.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:28 am

Crazygunner1 wrote:Maybe you are right...

But i still believe that you need to keep pressure becuase he is not gonna get anywhere now...not by a long shot. You probably have so much PPs to spend that you don´t even know what to build anymore Allied player can never allow that to happen or you have lost the game.

Well as to pp i get like 145 per turn.

But i still am in an rough position. I have to keep up fighter production or else loose air superiority with the russians...

And oh my i have been busy with my fleet. Its now to the lvl i want it.

I would also need to repair my ftr and all...

But one thing is sure: i am not loosing units.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:53 pm

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:52 pm

Nothing to report from the Eastern front. We are certainly plotting something interesting. we willsee if we can make it work.

Appart from that, we retake Nice and upgrade our fighters.

supermax · Post by **supermax** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:34 pm

Finally, we can uncover the final piece of our strategy... A surprise landing in North america...

We have been preparing this for a while how, and we are finally there. We were expecting to sail undetected till the shores of Canada,but Zechi smartly posted some STR on the shores to spot and prtect for his convoys. A bit dissapointing, but more historic, in the sense that the germans could not possibly surprise the allies with a landing right on the shores of canada. We will now see what we can do. With no Amphib capability its not going to be easy, but one thing is sure, the Allies are going to be very busy for a while, leaving Europe alone. So succeess or not, this operation will be a giant step in the right direction, that is preserving Forttress Europa!

So, a turn before we arrive ont he shores or America...

Then when we arrive. we find STR!!!

FORTRESS EUROPA - Game gamme stopped (RC9)

Turn 69

Turn 70: This is it, the dies are now cast!