Scutarii wrote:Some extra tests, phalanx 100% in flat terrain in a continuous line.
Looks like warbands (heavy foot) do his best in impact, here is a little surprising see how pikes do a worst job VS assaults compared with melee, average VS average (with some damage in warbands from lights) impact 19-23 favour warband, in counter 16-55 favour pike and warband retreat, with commander+superior the warband VS average pike 18-53 favour attacker and in counter results are less extreme but favour warband+commander.
The other combats are very similar, the impact favour warbands and in melee pikes can counter and ocassional deal great damage BUT the problem is that the core of results are 10-20 damage with practically no advantage for any side, this inmovilize the pike front easy and leave the other warbands room to flank... because VS medium foot (even the best greek medium placed in broken terrain) the medium warband smash them in impact phase and after lose 50 in impact numbers simple are to much + are more heavy foot warbands ready to support flanks or fill gaps in the line.
In attack phalanx is not very impresive at the point that i see how average 100% pike assault damage firm heavy warband and is repulsed with heavy casualties and disrupted...
My impresion is that phalanx is weak VS assaults from warbands heavy foot, in melee and attack do a better job in general (VS non warbands non roman heavy foot they are going to suffer a lot) but in general advantage is based in a masive use of pike leaving very few options to support units, oposite to old FOG results are less extreme and pike fronts are still dealing with first wave when flank forces formed by medium warbands and others smash the poor support units... best option is short front and create a front-flank with pikes but you depend of terrain and enemy to made your other flank and rear survive.
I feel that pike units need better defense VS assault and impact VS enemy when assault but mantein the less extreme results in melee with swordsmen dealing more damage to pikes bigger chance to see casualties in both units.
The point is intimidate enemy to prevent assaults... and use your units in asault to mantein him scared like in old FOG but in melee pikes are less impresive... maybe they can push back enemy... i refer heavy foot VS pikes means non pike units have a chance to break contact with pikes.
Lets see if we see changes in warbands and how impact other heavy foot units...
I simply do not agree this is a good and accurate representation on how it will go and why are you not going to start pushing your pikes against the warband and you should never just rely on pike phalanxes, you need to take them together with medium infantry, cavalry, light troops and elephants. The pikemen are not going to do this alone.
Only a select few pike will hold and pin the warbands in place while you push hard with a combination of elephants and pikes someplace else and your cavalry deal with any flanking threats.
The pikemen are much stronger than the warbands when attacking and simply stronger on defence. The pike phalanx will follow up if the warband withdraw when you initiate the attack and they will not withdraw every time they loose either. And sometimes the Warband is dosrupted on the charge as well and then rather likely to be fragmented during the melee, a disrupted pike can still fight relatively well a warband not so much.
All in all if you also count in the modifiers for succeeding with the cohesion test from a charge then the pike will com out on top. It is much more likely that the warband suffer negative modifier on their cohesion test for loosing with greater numbers and more than 5% of their combat strength. This will actually make it MORE or at the very least equally lekely that either get a cohesion drop and since a drop in cohesion is worse for the warband I say that the charge still favor the Phalanx.
