World War: AAR Plaid VS Supermax (No plaid allowed)

After action reports for Commander Europe at War.

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supermax
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Post by supermax »

Stauffenberg wrote:I think this shows the danger for the Axis to attack as early as April. When they don't have enough units they're more exposed to attacks like Supermax did. E. g. the units that landed in Tallinn would probably have done a better job if they had landed in Finland, but Plaid probably couldn't anticipate that Supermax would attack Finland so hard.

I think it's a bit reckless to send units eastwards in 1941 as if the Russians aren't even there for counter attacks. Since Plaid started so early he would have been better off always trying to keep a contiguous hex line. Bulges in the front line should be occupied by corps units so counter attacks won't be as expensive.

Guderian is not lost forever, but it will be almost a year until he returns. Losing an armor unit is not the end of the world, but it means an already weak Axis attack will become even weaker. This counters the early start of Barbarossa and that means giving up Libya and Sicily to get an early start will come back and bite Plaid.

If the Germans try to grab too much terrain in 1941 to make up for the losses everywhere then they will find out the hard way that the Russian winter is devastating to their units. You need to rest and form a defensive line some time before the severe winter starts. If not even the German units will get down to orange efficiency. Supermax will for sure counter attack with all he has during the winter in such a situation.

I think one important side of playing any wargame is to analyze the playing style of your opponent and plan accordingly. Everyone knows that Supermax is a super aggressive player who will counter attack if he gets the chance. That's one of his strengths, but maybe a weakness that can be exploited by elite players who likes to set traps for their opponents. So Plaid should have known that exposing his units WILL lead to counter attacks. Against a more defensive player you can get away with exposing your units.

I'm confident that this game will end with an Allied ultimate victory.

Hey Sauffenberg, nice to see you comment one of my games.

I love the part when you say you have to look at your opponent strategy and play accordingly. I totally agree with you. But to Plaid's defense most player will play defensivly in Russia for 1941. I think that once you wrapped your head around the way your opponent thinks, you have normally a winner. As to my take on Plaid's, well so far i cannot say, but he seems to be quite offensive, which is good i'll get a good number of opportunities.

As to your conclusion on an Ultimate allied victory, we'll just have to see. I am nomally a little sluggish with the Allies and tend to get side-tracked with fun operations all the time so sometimes throws back the final victory schedule...

I look at the number of Axis units attacking me and they are so few that i cannot foresee him seriously denting my rear-position / double-line of defense. He produced many tanks which give him rights to own the plains... But he wont be able to cover the whole front. I think he can only concentrate on 1 part of it. Once i see where he goes, the other line of defense will surely become a major counter-attack. Plaid put impressive defenses in Italy that's for sure and it will be blocking me for a long while, but at what cost? His Barbarossa is so weak i cannot even feel worried, he just doesnt have enough units to cover his flanks while trying to concentrates his attacks, because once he starts i will try to flank him.
supermax
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Post by supermax »

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schwerpunkt
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Post by schwerpunkt »

Max,
With respect to Plaids PP investment in southern Italy, I dont think that he has invested much at all. If I was defending in Libya, I'd have at least 2 German INF, a leader and a FTR anyway. I seldom use the Italian INF for anything other than anti-partisan operations so I dont think he has weakened his Barbarossa much at all. The big issue for him is not short term in my view but long term, as you can steadily build up your air projection over Italy and drain him of oil and PPs.
supermax
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Post by supermax »

schwerpunkt wrote:Max,
With respect to Plaids PP investment in southern Italy, I dont think that he has invested much at all. If I was defending in Libya, I'd have at least 2 German INF, a leader and a FTR anyway. I seldom use the Italian INF for anything other than anti-partisan operations so I dont think he has weakened his Barbarossa much at all. The big issue for him is not short term in my view but long term, as you can steadily build up your air projection over Italy and drain him of oil and PPs.
YEs, i think youre right... Its just that on my part i rarely send german troops in Italy until absolutly needed, that is when the enney is at the gates. I guess Plaid has no choice in the matter i am right down is throat...
Peter Stauffenberg
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Post by Peter Stauffenberg »

I think the worst for Plaid is that the intention of abandoning Libya was to free up units for an early Barbarossa. Instead ALL of the units he withdrew are now in southern Italy or were destroyed in Sicily. He even sent several German units to southern Italy similar to those you send to Libya to reinforce the Tobruk area. So Plaid has achieved absolutely NOTHING by this strategy.

He does not have a stronger Barbarossa than normally and he has to defend for his life in Italy. Those units won't leave the area our Italy will be knocked out of the war in no time. That means Supermax can use Allied units to invade elsewhere to drain even more units to the area, away from the east front.

I think this just proves that abandoning North Africa to free up units will only work against very defensively oriented Allied players who don't even send probes into Libya to check the defenses there. Once the Allied player realizes he can easily take Libya he will try for sure. You don't have to be of Supermax'es calibre to do that once you know there are only garrisons left defending.

Abandoning Libya is necessary at some time, but I think 1940 is way too early. You need to keep the Allies at a distance until the Americans join and that can be done in Libya. You don't have to move with force into Egypt. All you have to do is to keep such a presence of units there that the Allies will have to wait for reinforcements, leader, tac bombers, maybe another fighter and armor etc. before attacking. That means you've bought some time till at least second half of 1941. Then you can play a fighting retreat in Libya and only think about evacuation when Torch start.

So I hope people reading the AAR's see the consequences of an early withdrawal from Libya. I think this is a BIG strategic mistake and maybe even a game loser if the two players are of equal strength. I'm sure that people like Ronnie, Joe, Jim etc. would have exploited such a move if I did it.
supermax
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Post by supermax »

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supermax
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Post by supermax »

Nothing much to report we are still reeling back, Leningrad should fall soon, my reinforcements got ambushed in the Atlantic last turn and Landed in Northern Italy.

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supermax
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Turn 38

Post by supermax »

Well, more cities falls into the Soviet Union. I foresee Plaid stopping his offensive by now

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supermax
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Post by supermax »

Well. I have decided that without risk, you do not win anything.

So i have again opted to be bold, and i think i have a reasonnable chance of success. Seeing the few troops in Russia on the german side of things made me devise a plan that had been in the making for a while and now rendered possible with the Voronezh position that the germans overlooked. I think that by rapidly sliding my forces south and north (from Moscow and Stalindgrad) that i can catch the german wrong-footed in his defensive posturing. I think he thinks that i was going to be offensiving in the Rostov area. Well, no. It will be in the Koursk-Orel sector.

We will now see if lucks favors the bold. IF we get mud or winter, the germans will be hard-pressed. IF clear, he might retreat or we might get into a shooting match where i will loose a lot of units, but where he will have to fight in the dead of winter. Either way i am almost sure i will surprise him with this move.

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supermax
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Post by supermax »

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Crazygunner1
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Post by Crazygunner1 »

Hi Max, how are you? Nice to see that you are still on top.

I had some trouble with my computer before and we had to abandon the game....

See that a winter offensive is ongoing....nice

Good luck
supermax
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Post by supermax »

Crazygunner1 wrote:Hi Max, how are you? Nice to see that you are still on top.

I had some trouble with my computer before and we had to abandon the game....

See that a winter offensive is ongoing....nice

Good luck
Thanks man! I am doing well and i keep going on hammering my opponents.

Hows your computer now? :)
Crazygunner1
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Post by Crazygunner1 »

Up and running with latest mods and all...actually finishing one old game and have started another new. The old one is actually identical to your AAR america in Flames. US will soon be out of the war and shortly there after england will surrender. Russian front is stable, things are looking good.

I tried to jumpstart our game, but didn´t get anywhere, only a lot of error messages, strange colours...so on...

Crazyg
supermax
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All quiet on the allied side of things!

Post by supermax »

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trulster
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Post by trulster »

INteresting game! But waht is the point in producing a sub with the Americans? With almost no axis surface navy would not a DD be better? Or are you going to use it as a unsinkable convoy "escort"?
Peter Stauffenberg
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Post by Peter Stauffenberg »

Subs are good to have to attack enemy ships in port. Only subs and aircraft can attack ports. So US subs can be used to finish off the Italian warships in ports.

Subs are also great to have to blockade ports. I like to use the strategy to let subs be in the retreat path on ports like Tobruk, Benghazi and Tripoli. That means the Axis player will form a transport and try to evacuate back to Italy. Instead the transport is stopped and it can be attacked with air and subs. DD's can't hide so using subs are often good to have to lure your opponent into thinking it's safe to move while it's not.

I also like to use Allied subs to protect transports when they're moving to the enemy shore line. This is particularly important when you have less escorts than the number of hexes adjacent to the transports. The point is to lure the German or Italian subs to move to the hex they think is safe to attack a transport from. Instead they will move and bump to another location where they can't reach the transport. So you can ruin several dangerous sub attacks.

So don't underestimate the power of subs for the Allies.
trulster
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Post by trulster »

Yes, good points, but in this game North Africa is taken and Italian BB sunk, so very little use. A DD can do the rest as well as provide shore bombardment which will be highly useful when the time comes to invade Italy/France.
supermax
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Post by supermax »

trulster wrote:INteresting game! But waht is the point in producing a sub with the Americans? With almost no axis surface navy would not a DD be better? Or are you going to use it as a unsinkable convoy "escort"?
Exactly the plan. An unsikable one. And beside, ive been in many games where the Axis player produced surface units in 1942. This will enable me to respond in kind without producing too many BB and CV.
trulster
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Post by trulster »

Cool, and though I have certainly done the same thing myself, i cant help feeling that the use of subs as invincible convoy escorts is a bit of a gamey exploit - it makes little historical sense but is hard to to disallow under current game engine. Again, no critique of this particular game as it is quite common, but it does seem a bit strange!.
supermax
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Post by supermax »

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