Panzer Corps 2 Pacific DLC Shelved

[Retributarr]

'

(1) Enough with the personal attacks on Kerensky. The Panzer General franchise has always been German-centric: IT'S IN THE TITLE. I thoroughly enjoyed AO '46, even though in this fictional alt-history I would have been on the losing side. I have been fascinated by the Wunderwaffe since I was a child, and it was fun to deploy some of them, especially the landcruisers. Thanks, Kerensky, for your hard and rewarding work!

(2) Better no Pacific DLC than a disappointing one. As others have noted already, there is much possible new content that doesn't require naval operations. And, after all, we have to leave something for PC3! Naval operations are not the only aspect of the game that could benefit from a major upgrade... but that's a topic for another day.

"I totally agree!". Overall "Kerensky" has done an "Awesome-Job"-"Even a Spectacular Job"... but!... definitely "Not-a Perfect Job"... as there are some failings in it. This "PzC2" is about "Germanys War Effort"... not the "Western Allies War Effort"... so therefore it will be somewhat biased for and into Germany's favor!... that has to be expected!.

At the same time i am formidably dismayed that of... the "SSI-Teams" lackluster progress and performance!. They are indicating that they are unable to resolve the issues of completing this "WWII Pacific War Effort"... it seems that they need "Supreme Divine Guidance" from a higher power to overcome their "Hang-Ups!". Perhaps some "Gifted-Forum-Members" can "Throw-Them-A-Bone or Two"... to start to steer them onto the right-track!.

[Bee1976]

And the score is 9 - 0.

Hehehe i see what you did there!

Dont feel toooo safe about it, i highly recommend that you raise to let me say 12 - 0 this year

[Bee1976]

Ok it is a deception, but by the way do we know all the real reasons? Is-it simply a limitation of the actual engine or something linked to the development team or the production?

I would assume that the naval battles are the biggest problem. On land you got supply lines, close tiles open tiles, rivers mountains, hills, enttrenchment a lot of stuff that affects strategic decision outside of used units and encountered uitns.
right now you have water as only terrain and units with range and attack values. Thats it. I thin its really hard to create fun naval battles out of this
But thats just my guess

[Kerensky]

Thank you everyone for your support and kind words. It means a lot to me. I expected to come back to this thread with more accusations, but I was delighted to find support instead. It has become amusing to be called 'Nazi' over on the Steam Forums for focusing on Axis orientated content so far, considering how diametrically opposed that is to switching to now being aligned with a regime currently at war under a very clear goal of DE-Nazifying Ukraine. lol

Anyways, let's keep in mind we're able to speak freely here, even with scathing criticisms, but let's also remember that actions have consequences. As evidenced by my extraordinary post count, I enjoy engaging with the community and getting direct forum feedback, even if I don't always like what people have to say. I would be greatly saddened to have to withdraw my engagement if matters become too uncivil.

A very real and very worrying trend in gaming. And one that is also being abused to shield problems against valid criticism as well. Just all around, not a good trend.

https://www.pcgamer.com/cities-skylines ... community/

[Kerensky]

I would assume that the naval battles are the biggest problem. On land you got supply lines, close tiles open tiles, rivers mountains, hills, enttrenchment a lot of stuff that affects strategic decision outside of used units and encountered uitns.
right now you have water as only terrain and units with range and attack values. Thats it. I thin its really hard to create fun naval battles out of this
But thats just my guess

Unfortunately, there is no light I can shed on the topic of Pacific. On the one hand, there are things I just can't say about it, and on the other hand, my involvement with Pacific was extremely limited, so I simply don't know the whole story either. This is not a surprise, it's been publicly stated elsewhere that Pacific was a 'different team' after all.

Maybe someday those involved will tell their story about Pacific and what happened...

What I can say is that making Panzer Corps content is insanely hard work. It's grueling, and it's time consuming, and it requires so much more than just 'making money' as a motivation to get the job done. There has to be passion for this sort of thing. No one told me to make 1946 have 30 scenarios, it's something I put forward because I wanted to make the biggest USA invasion campaign that has ever existed in any Panzer General-esque game. The original Panzer General was a single USA scenario, Panzer General 2 had two scenarios, Savannah and Oak Ridge. Panzer Corps had three scenarios, two of which I made by the way, and Panzer Corps 2 retained that tradition with three scenarios on launch.

Well, the spirit of Axis Operations has always been to REALLY deep dive and explore these conflicts in much greater detail, and now we have a giant 1946 campaign with some really wild additions like Atomic AoE weapons and gigantic Landkreuzers stuffed with many special mechanics to make them function uniquely.

All of these things are not things done easily, simply, cheaply, or quickly. I could go on and on and on, or share the spreadsheets of spreadsheets I prepared to organize 1946, but instead I'll let a picture tell a story. This is what Panzer Corps development really looks like:




Just imagine the time spent sitting, and working, in a chair for it to look like that. The leather is just disintegrating. The plastic so fatigued from use that it was completely broken. You can't pay someone to sit in a chair that much, they have to want to be in that chair.

[Retributarr]

I would assume that the naval battles are the biggest problem. On land you got supply lines, close tiles open tiles, rivers mountains, hills, enttrenchment a lot of stuff that affects strategic decision outside of used units and encountered uitns.
right now you have water as only terrain and units with range and attack values. Thats it. I thin its really hard to create fun naval battles out of this
But thats just my guess

What I can say is that making Panzer Corps content is insanely hard work. It's grueling, and it's time consuming, and it requires so much more than just 'making money' as a motivation to get the job done. There has to be passion for this sort of thing.

All of these things are not things done easily, simply, cheaply, or quickly. I could go on and on and on, or share the spreadsheets of spreadsheets I prepared to organize 1946, but instead I'll let a picture tell a story. This is what Panzer Corps development really looks like:




Just imagine the time spent sitting, and working, in a chair for it to look like that. The leather is just disintegrating. The plastic so fatigued from use that it was completely broken. You can't pay someone to sit in a chair that much, they have to want to be in that chair.

HAIL "KERENSKY!!!".

[ME262]

HAIL is correct! I'm 70 yrs.old an I still race home to play this game!!! What ever content his team has produced I own. Let no one speak badly about the dedication this man & team have worked to provide us the fans with hours an hours of GREAT gaming time. So what if Pacific has not worked out, perhaps in time it may, There is volumes of content still that can be created. Hail again to the team!!! Never give up an never quit.

[adiekmann]

I'm saddened by the comments basically calling Kerensky a Nazi Lover. It must be because of his AI created art.

I'm also disappointed to hear that Pacific General is postponed indefinitely. I think we all could imagine the difficulties from the beginning. It's hard to separate those island battles from any meaningful naval combat and I guess they couldn't figure out a way to make it work in a satisfying way with the current engine.

Now I wonder what campaigns/DLCs await us instead? Sounds like they have been working on them already.

Anyone ready to wager a bet, or vote for which one they would most like to see first?

• Afrika Korps?

• British Campaign?

• American Campaign (Europe)?

• Soviet Campaign?

• German (West) Campaign?

• Micro campaign focused on a specific unit/region (like FSJ, Balkins, Norway, Commando Operations, Japanese land campaign in _______, etc.?

While I have always loved the African theater of operations, I think I'm first ready for an Allied campaign so I can de-Nazify myself after playing all of these pro-Nazi scenarios. I think killing fictional Nazis will, I hope, cleanse my soul.

[Panzer73]

I would love to see a an Allied Campaign in the West and North Africa, as well as a Soviet campaign in the East.

The trajectory with Germany (and Japan) is victory - stagnation - defeat, whereas the trajectory with the Allies and the SU is the reverse. I like the historical path in AO'43 through AO'45, saving my units from one Soviet offensive to another.

There haven't been many defense-focused scenarios in the AO series. This is true for the historical path as well, as only half of the scenarios in AO'44 and AO'45 were on the historical path and some of those were focused on counter-attacks and operations to prevent defections of minor Axis nations.

So I would like to stage a fighting retreat across Belgium and France, fight see-saw battles in the desert, return to Europe only to be stymied (Italy) and finally win in the West. And ditto for the Eastern front.

Thank you to Kerensky and Slitherine for giving me thousands of hours of fun! 1810.3 to be exact as of January 19th. I look forward to many thousands more!

[VirgilInTheSKY]

There haven't been many defense-focused scenarios in the AO series. This is true for the historical path as well, as only half of the scenarios in AO'44 and AO'45 were on the historical path and some of those were focused on counter-attacks and operations to prevent defections of minor Axis nations.

So I would like to stage a fighting retreat across Belgium and France, fight see-saw battles in the desert, return to Europe only to be stymied (Italy) and finally win in the West. And ditto for the Eastern front.

I think Kerensky did that on purpose, one defensive scenario after another can be tiresome, so offensive ones or at least counterattack operations have to be inserted to avoid that. It also helps digging up some battles and operations not that well known under the large picture of the collapse of Axis Powers.

[Tassadar]

Anyone ready to wager a bet, or vote for which one they would most like to see first?

• Afrika Korps?

• British Campaign?

• American Campaign (Europe)?

• Soviet Campaign?

• German (West) Campaign?

• Micro campaign focused on a specific unit/region (like FSJ, Balkins, Norway, Commando Operations, Japanese land campaign in _______, etc.?

While I have always loved the African theater of operations, I think I'm first ready for an Allied campaign so I can de-Nazify myself after playing all of these pro-Nazi scenarios. I think killing fictional Nazis will, I hope, cleanse my soul.

My strongest bet is on Allied campaign, be it British, American or combined, as the game supports multi-nation cores in a campaign just fine. It would be a welcome and refreshing change to see the other side in a campaign, get some new units, adjust existing ones and utilize some of the battles that did not yet appear in the series.

Afrika Korps would be nice, but for the time being I think the game needs something more radically different and besides, I still hope that this can be in the far future simply incorporated into AO West, once we get some different content.

Soviet Campaign would be interesting to see as well, but it would somewhat overlap with AO East missions already, so it probably would be best to save it for later to make the campaign stand out more and feel different.

As for micro campaign, I think these will be the very last thing to appear if at all. They seem like something mods would pick up at one point instead, or as some sort of a extra bonus as we await larger DLC if ever Pacific Corps gets picked up again for example. If Order of Battle was able to release a Finnish campaign, it means it is not totally impossible for something like this to be done, but it's least likely. I'll keep my fingers crossed for my Italian campaign, but might as well paly the lottery to fund it.

I'm also disappointed to hear that Pacific General is postponed indefinitely. I think we all could imagine the difficulties from the beginning. It's hard to separate those island battles from any meaningful naval combat and I guess they couldn't figure out a way to make it work in a satisfying way with the current engine.

There is also one limitation/issue that I observed going through the Units.csv file and that is Japanese units are all over the place and need serious rework, as their stats are at times very, very strange, especially on planes, but some tanks and other vehicles as well. A few are perfectly fine as-is, but for example why on earth does the Type 3 Chi-Nu have Rapid Fire 1.5x and such poor hard attack values remains a mystery to me. I assume it is something that was looked at in Pacific Corps development, but since it got shelved, these values did not really get reviewed in more detail.

[wecker]

I'm saddened by the comments basically calling Kerensky a Nazi Lover. It must be because of his AI created art.
...
While I have always loved the African theater of operations, I think I'm first ready for an Allied campaign so I can de-Nazify myself after playing all of these pro-Nazi scenarios. I think killing fictional Nazis will, I hope, cleanse my soul.

You nailed it completely

I love to play these games not because of my nationality or my political affiliation. I play it for fun, out of curiosity, out of historical interest and thinking about "what could have happened if".

I play with my full heart as a German or Soviet without being a Nazi or a Communist.

Arguing that way is simply out of order.

All teams and persons of Slitherine - keep on your good work. You can never satisfy all expectations.

[RandomAttack]

I would assume that the naval battles are the biggest problem. On land you got supply lines, close tiles open tiles, rivers mountains, hills, enttrenchment a lot of stuff that affects strategic decision outside of used units and encountered uitns.
right now you have water as only terrain and units with range and attack values. Thats it. I thin its really hard to create fun naval battles out of this
But thats just my guess

Unfortunately, there is no light I can shed on the topic of Pacific. On the one hand, there are things I just can't say about it, and on the other hand, my involvement with Pacific was extremely limited, so I simply don't know the whole story either. This is not a surprise, it's been publicly stated elsewhere that Pacific was a 'different team' after all.

Maybe someday those involved will tell their story about Pacific and what happened...

What I can say is that making Panzer Corps content is insanely hard work. It's grueling, and it's time consuming, and it requires so much more than just 'making money' as a motivation to get the job done. There has to be passion for this sort of thing. No one told me to make 1946 have 30 scenarios, it's something I put forward because I wanted to make the biggest USA invasion campaign that has ever existed in any Panzer General-esque game. The original Panzer General was a single USA scenario, Panzer General 2 had two scenarios, Savannah and Oak Ridge. Panzer Corps had three scenarios, two of which I made by the way, and Panzer Corps 2 retained that tradition with three scenarios on launch.

Well, the spirit of Axis Operations has always been to REALLY deep dive and explore these conflicts in much greater detail, and now we have a giant 1946 campaign with some really wild additions like Atomic AoE weapons and gigantic Landkreuzers stuffed with many special mechanics to make them function uniquely.

All of these things are not things done easily, simply, cheaply, or quickly. I could go on and on and on, or share the spreadsheets of spreadsheets I prepared to organize 1946, but instead I'll let a picture tell a story. This is what Panzer Corps development really looks like:




Just imagine the time spent sitting, and working, in a chair for it to look like that. The leather is just disintegrating. The plastic so fatigued from use that it was completely broken. You can't pay someone to sit in a chair that much, they have to want to be in that chair.

"You WANT me in that chair. You NEED me in that chair..."

[terminator]

Will there be an improvement in sound effects before ?

[monkspider]

Hail Kerensky and the almighty chair both!

The Axis Ops series was something really special, I hope we don't have to wait TOO long for your next content but you have definitely deserved a bit of a break after cranking so many DLCs.

[Kerensky]

Will there be an improvement in sound effects before ?

This was actually slated to be a part of the larger Pacific package... so unfortunately I'm not sure about the fate of that upgrade.

As I'm sure several people noticed, we turned on Japanese unit models for 1946 (and added more new units, such as the Shiden fighter and Japanese jets and 6 engine Fugaku)

If you're wondering why the Akagi survived Midway to show up in 1946 in the alternate history... well because that's the Japanese aircraft carrier model that was available to use.

There's no Hosho, Taiho, Juno, Unryu, Hiyo, Kaga, Hiryu, Soryu, Shinano, or any other Japanese aircraft carrier models that were produced... And those are just names I can rattle off the top of my head, I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting. (Shokaku/Zuikaku were models ordered during the 1946 asset run)

From this lack of Japanese ship models, we can pretty much glean that Pacific was planned to be ground battle focused, I imagine a lot of island hopping battles, and perhaps something like the Battle for Manila, which I believe was the only 'large urban' battle of the Pacific Theater. But that's just educated guessing, I don't actually know.

[Tassadar]

There's no Hosho, Taiho, Juno, Unryu, Hiyo, Kaga, Hiryu, Soryu, Shinano, or any other Japanese aircraft carrier models that were produced... And those are just names I can rattle off the top of my head, I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting. (Shokaku/Zuikaku were models ordered during the 1946 asset run)

This would explain the weird stats on some older Japanese units. Makes sense, they probably never got to the point of being double checked and potentially revised.

[PanzerCro]

HAIL is correct! I'm 70 yrs.old an I still race home to play this game!!! What ever content his team has produced I own. Let no one speak badly about the dedication this man & team have worked to provide us the fans with hours an hours of GREAT gaming time. So what if Pacific has not worked out, perhaps in time it may, There is volumes of content still that can be created. Hail again to the team!!! Never give up an never quit.

Kerensky is a legend ! I hope he provides us with a LOT of more PC2 content before we eventually move to PC 3 one day

[PanzerCro]

I'm saddened by the comments basically calling Kerensky a Nazi Lover. It must be because of his AI created art.

I'm also disappointed to hear that Pacific General is postponed indefinitely. I think we all could imagine the difficulties from the beginning. It's hard to separate those island battles from any meaningful naval combat and I guess they couldn't figure out a way to make it work in a satisfying way with the current engine.

Now I wonder what campaigns/DLCs await us instead? Sounds like they have been working on them already.

Anyone ready to wager a bet, or vote for which one they would most like to see first?

• Afrika Korps?

• British Campaign?

• American Campaign (Europe)?

• Soviet Campaign?

• German (West) Campaign?

• Micro campaign focused on a specific unit/region (like FSJ, Balkins, Norway, Commando Operations, Japanese land campaign in _______, etc.?

While I have always loved the African theater of operations, I think I'm first ready for an Allied campaign so I can de-Nazify myself after playing all of these pro-Nazi scenarios. I think killing fictional Nazis will, I hope, cleanse my soul.

Logical thing would be one BIG allied and one BIG soviet one (with few standalones micro's as you mentioned) and after that we switch to Panzer Corps 2: Peopel's General

[Bee1976]

Just imagine the time spent sitting, and working, in a chair for it to look like that.

To be honest my chairs looks the same, but not from work. I got 4 little feline artists here (and im too fat...hehe)


But to be honest part II, i really hope your next chair will look even worse after the next DLCs you created for us

€dit:
I hope for SovietCorps as the next series, maybe with an opportunity to start in SCW aswell, and with the battle for Tokio in the ahistoric part (if there is one)
I still dream of a city battle that feels like Madrid + Warshaw + Stalingrad + Berlin + Washington all in one