The Rally Point (discussion and questions)

[jomni]

How are you guys liking the Silk Road armies?

[stockwellpete]

How are you guys liking the Silk Road armies?

The Di v Chinese match-up we are using in the From Cyrus to Tigranes section is a very interesting encounter. I think the Di are the stronger army, but on certain battlefields (e.g. wooded) the Chinese can give a good account of themselves. So far 5 of the results of the 15 matches involving these two armies are in and the Di are leading 3-1, with 1 match drawn.

[devoncop]

Hi Jomni

I had the drawn game Pete referred to above. I found the Di cavalry dominated their Chinese counterparts but the missile power of Chinese infantry dominated the Di infantry leading to a
draw.

Interesting contest.

[SnuggleBunnies]

I found the Chinese mixed infantry to be just awful, except the armored ones. They do okay against cavalry, but if the Di bring lots of melee infantry, the combo of only having 50 melee poa, and -50% for xbows vs foot combined with only 50% xbows made them total garbage. It was much more useful to max out on melee infantry, grab the armored foot, and mostly just buy as much cavalry as possible.

[devoncop]

I found the Chinese mixed infantry to be just awful, except the armored ones. They do okay against cavalry, but if the Di bring lots of melee infantry, the combo of only having 50 melee poa, and -50% for xbows vs foot combined with only 50% xbows made them total garbage. It was much more useful to max out on melee infantry, grab the armored foot, and mostly just buy as much cavalry as possible.

That may be why our experience differed.

My opponent maxed infantry but I maxed Cavalry liking the flexibility.

[bbogensc]

why are some my archers and med inf moving 3 spaces?

[rbodleyscott]

Well the short answer is because somehow they appear to have got 14 AP instead of their normal 10. The only time that units should get extra AP is if they pursue something, when there is a random plus or minus 4 AP. I suppose if they started the pursuit routine but for some reason could not move this might happen. But there don't appear to be any enemy about.

Obviously it is a bug, but one we have not come across before. Can you tell us anything about the circumstances?

[bbogensc]

No pursuit on the units, the game was just beginning maybe 2nd move.

[bbogensc]

Here is a screenshot of a med inf also with the extra move. I

[bbogensc]

Apparent combat glitch. The following is 2 screenshots for a league game Classical Antiquity Div E that seems to show a glitch where Indian archers that have been reduced to a strength of 382 fight at full strength 480.

First screenshot is an elephant charge on the archer unit in the turn that kills 33. Archer unit began the turn at 415/480. After elephant charge archer unit total is 382/480.

Second screenshot is a cavalry charge in the flank that kills 17 on the archer unit in the same turn. However, the combat dialogue shows the second charge is calculated with archers at full strength 480/480. End turn archer unit is at 365/480 and has miraculously withstood both charges.

This seems to be a major combat glitch unless I am missing something. Prior combat results were very unfavorably so I started taking screenshots as I could not believe the results.

Regards, bbogensc

[bbogensc]

Here is the combat dialogue on the archer unit on the second cavalry flank charge showing the archer unit fights at 480/480 on the second melee.

bbogensc

[stockwellpete]

Hold on though, the in-game cursor is pointing at a disrupted red Indo-Greek archer unit not the blue Indian archer unit that has been charged by the elephant and then the cavalry unit. That is why you are seeing 480 men, I think. So the screenshot is not actually showing what you say it is. The blue Indian archer unit has suffered a cohesion loss due to the flank charge but has not suffered a further drop due to the impact combat result.

[rbodleyscott]

And the unit UI at the bottom of the screen is not the combat dialogue.

(For combat log, press C. However, note that combat strength is not taken into account at impact - both sides fight with the smaller number of men at impact.)

[pbuck777]

Your in-game cursor in the third screenshot has highlighted your own unit that disrupted without taking any losses after a nearby friendly unit routed earlier in the game - it's not the same archer unit that the elephants collided with in the 2nd screenshot. Prior combat results in this game were not abnormal, either. I don't have an explanation for your first screenshot, but I've got several other games going with the Indians (even one as the Indo-Greeks), both as the Indians and opposing them, and this is the first time I've seen something like that. At any rate, I never observed your infantry units moving too far too fast in our game, and I know mine didn't. I have never seen Indian foot units moving three spaces or having 14 action points, in this or any other game. I haven't been able to duplicate that first screenshot in any newly started custom games.

[bbogensc]

Quick question: Do severely disordered units fight at the same strength if disrupted also? Here we have a screenshot of elephants several disordered elephant (-45%) versus severely disordered elephant, disrupted (-45%), same modifier in melee when disrupted also. Maybe the melee modifier on moral/cohesion maxes out at -45%?

[stockwellpete]

Does anyone know the answer? I don't have the faintest idea about all these POA's and stuff.

[MikeC_81]

I am reasonably sure they stack, maybe there is a cap. Its been a while since I did the tests. But its not really an important question fwiw. At such severe levels of penalties, combat is like 90% chance to draw if not more. It is unlikely anyone is getting anything done.

[bbogensc]

The melee has been run 7 times thus far with the disruption, so the difference bw 75% and 90% odds matters here, also to the outcome of the match. Seems like it should stack and that should be 65% 45%. Is there a glitch or does disruption not matter at all if units are severely disordered? The rule book at least implies that disruption always reduces combat effectiveness. I've never noticed a disrupted unit fighting at full strength in the POA.

[stockwellpete]

The melee has been run 7 times thus far with the disruption, so the difference bw 75% and 90% odds matters here, also to the outcome of the match. Seems like it should stack and that should be 65% 45%. Is there a glitch or does disruption not matter at all if units are severely disordered? The rule book at least implies that disruption always reduces combat effectiveness. I've never noticed a disrupted unit fighting at full strength in the POA.

It is best to ask these sort of questions in the main forum where Richard, the game designer, is more likely to see it.

[bbogensc]

Ok, I playtested it. The moral/disruption modifier maxes out at 45%. So, it does not stack above 45%. Disruption does not effect severely disordered units.