Slitherine

bru888 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 9:26 pm In Tuppura Island I was puzzled for a while by the subtitle of "Betrayal of General Winter." Who is General Winter?

I have the book below and he is in the cover.



Your guess is accurate and tells what the betrayal meant.

bru888 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 10:00 pm A bit of a dilemma that I need to deal with again: Saying "Tuppuransaari Island" is like saying "Tuppura Island Island" because "saari" is Finnish for "island," apparently. I want to use local names, in Finnish, whenever possible; I did so in Turku and elsewhere and probably will do so again. Folks will figure out "Viipurinlahti" is Viipuri Bay, won't they? Regardless, you will not see "Viipurinlahti Bay," either.

The local name is just Tuppura without saari even though it is an island. This is not uncommon. Imo Tuppura Island is better than Tuppuransaari Island just like you concluded. Similarly Viipurinlahti -> Viipuri Bay. Hmm, on the other hand there is this: typically this kind of Finnish names are in genitive case denoted here with the 'n' at the end of the word. Incidentally, Finnish being an easy language to learn has 15 grammatical cases. Anyway, because of this for instance Viipurinlahti would either be Bay of Viipuri or Viipuri's Bay if one wants to be precise. I like Bay of Viipuri, but what's your take being the leading authority of English language in this forum? Maybe just Viipuri Bay because that's the way such names are in the English speaking world (e.g. Tampa Bay)?

Gabe's image with two lines of text is very nice, but not currently possible, true?

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:13 amI did not understand one word of that briefing gibberish - what was that? Scottish?

It is accurate, though, to the best of my knowledge. Yer suppoosed to git the kin, lad, or tae be googlin' it.

// BRIEFINGS
briefing_2_0 = Haud yer wheesht, lads! Ah cannae talk o'er yer blether. Aye, tha's juist a wee bit be'er. Noo tae the Salt 'n' Sauce, eh? We ha'e a job tae dae here. Help ma boab, but we bonnie Scots ha'e been choosen tae lead this here attack!
briefing_2_1 = 'Tis for oos to take the crossin's o'er yon burn they call the Odon. Once we a' done that, the 11th Armoored is tae take the high ground beyond.
briefing_2_2 = The 11th's got their oon goals shuin here on a' map. The idea is to oopen the way to the Orne and a back duir to Caen. A nod's as guid as a wink tae a blind horse on tha' one, I tell ye!
briefing_2_3 = By th' way, HQ says jerry's grounded duie tae weather bein' dreich. We may be able tae bag oos some a' their craft if we get tae the Aerodrome in time.
briefing_2_4 = Well, lads, it bein' the fust time oota the gate fir oos, so tae speak, whit's fur ye'll no go past ye. They say, Failin' means yer playin'. Ye believe that, yer heid's fulla mince. There int no fail! Keep yer heid clear and shoo 'em hoo Highlanders fight! Ah dinnae ken wha' else tae sae tae ye but 'Lang may yer lum reek!'

CoolDTA wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:08 am I have the book below and he is in the cover.

As a matter of fact, I found that image in Wikipedia and I am using it in the scenario to illustrate the term.

CoolDTA wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:08 am Your guess is accurate and tells what the betrayal meant.

You mean that the Finns were "betrayed" by winter this time; the waters around the island are frozen, allowing Soviet land attack. Technically, betrayal means being thwarted by someone or something that is usually on your side. In this case, the concept of their Russian Winter being on the side of the Russians as an ally against invaders is a bit shaky to apply to the Finns. True, as the the scenario description mentions, the Finns used "arctic conditions" to their advantage in the Winter War but in this case it would be "Kenraali Talvi," yes? Or some Finnish metaphor for winter? But we digress. If I had a bout of head-scratching over "General Winter," I can imagine how even the most hard core grognards would be dithering over "Betrayed by Kenraali Talvi."

CoolDTA wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:08 am I like Bay of Viipuri, but what's your take being the leading authority of English language in this forum? Maybe just Viipuri Bay because that's the way such names are in the English speaking world (e.g. Tampa Bay)?

Actually, I am going with Viipurinlahti on the map with a reference in the text that it means Viipuri Bay. Thanks also for the tip on Tuppura (no "saari") vs. Kuninkaansaari ("King's Island," I believe?) being the local names. Over here, we say "Tampa Bay" instead of "Bay of Tampa" except if it is a literal translation of some name that sticks over time, such as Cuba's "Bahía de Cochinos" coming across as "Bay of Pigs."

CoolDTA wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:08 am Gabe's image with two lines of text is very nice, but not currently possible, true?

Only God and Gabe know how he did that. He works wonders in his mod. But that's the thing; it is his mod and unless the vast majority of us were to adopt it (which TA might not cast a kindly eye upon - it's hard to pinpoint where that line lies), custom work designed with it would have very limited application. And Gabe cannot accomplish everything, as he implied in his post; the location box will not expand to suit. Funny how that is with me; I tend to be a perfectionist when it comes to the visual in this game. That overrun of text outside the box would bother me and I would not use it.

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:16 pm You mean that the Finns were "betrayed" by winter this time; the waters around the island are frozen, allowing Soviet land attack.

Yes, that's it. We don't really use the concept "General Winter" (or Kenraali Talvi) - it usually applies to Russia. I know you can't be surprised The Source uses it in a wrong way.

"General Famine and General Winter, rather than Russian bullets have conquered the Grand Army."
- Marshall Ney

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:16 pm Actually, I am going with Viipurinlahti on the map with a reference in the text that it means Viipuri Bay. Thanks also for the tip on Tuppura (no "saari") vs. Kuninkaansaari ("King's Island," I believe?) being the local names. Over here, we say "Tampa Bay" instead of "Bay of Tampa" except if it is a literal translation of some name that sticks over time, such as Cuba's "Bahía de Cochinos" coming across as "Bay of Pigs."

Good choice to go with Viipurinlahti and a reference. Thanks for confirming you use location + Bay (etc.) in English (no genitive case except with certain exceptions). Yes, it is King's Island.

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:16 pm Only God and Gabe know how he did that. He works wonders in his mod.

I think he used some graphics editor software to show how it could be, not his mod.

Erik2 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 7:52 am After using your mod testing Crete and other custom scenarios I plan to use the mod whenever I'm playing OOB.
I think it is very good. Kudos

Holy moley... God spoke...and praised a MOD?

Thanks Erik, very kind!

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 12:43 pm

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:13 amI did not understand one word of that briefing gibberish - what was that? Scottish?

It is accurate, though, to the best of my knowledge. Yer suppoosed to git the kin, lad, or tae be googlin' it.

Really? That's your advice? It's like you to have a real Finn helping you with every letter of an (to you at least) unknown language, and I'm to "use google"? Thanks...

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:16 pm [...] the location box will not expand to suit. Funny how that is with me; I tend to be a perfectionist when it comes to the visual in this game. That overrun of text outside the box would bother me and I would not use it.

About the same with me. Not a viable solution like this. But within one line, that text shrinks to a size too small to read.

CoolDTA wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:47 pm

bru888 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:16 pm Only God and Gabe know how he did that. He works wonders in his mod.

I think he used some graphics editor software to show how it could be, not his mod.

OK, the comment was real funny .... but I'm a bit surprised to hear that from Bruce, the resident popup/briefing specialist around here and actually the one who gave me the idea in the first place. I wrote a few posts back that I've adopted a few of Bruce's text corrections into my mod. One was to remove a duplicate "line break" symbol, something like this "|". Open the "text_english.txt" file inside the (saved) scen folder with an editor and copy/paste the character in. No biggie, really.

Well! I got it to work, after the usual teeth-pulling!

Ahh, Viipuri. I have reached you at last. You are second only to Turku in my heart. I will do everything in my power to give you an even chance not to be assimilated by the borg. Vyborg, that is.

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:10 pm ...and praised a MOD?

I've never been totally opposed to using mods and here's the proof
I started work on this mod couple of years back, but never got around to finish it.
It mainly gives you historical ship class naval speed/movement and a a different air unit movement system (longer movements and fewer turns in the air).

Wonderful! I'm eager to try this.

Mascarenhas wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 11:47 am Wonderful! I'm eager to try this.

Sorry, I have no current plans to finish this mod.

It's a pity, but I understand. You've a lot more to do. Keep up and cheers!

Mascarenhas wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 9:37 pm It's a pity, but I understand. You've a lot more to do. Keep up and cheers!

Perhaps you will accept as consolation Winter War 1940, now out in beta.

Erik2 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 8:18 am

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:10 pm ...and praised a MOD?

I've never been totally opposed to using mods and here's the proof
I started work on this mod couple of years back, but never got around to finish it.
It mainly gives you historical ship class naval speed/movement and a a different air unit movement system (longer movements and fewer turns in the air).


mod.jpg

What port city is that? Looks like San Diego, California, where I live....

rafdobrowolski wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:36 am What port city is that? Looks like San Diego, California, where I live....

That's modern day Vyborg, to which name Viipuri was changed when it became Soviet territory after the Winter War. Interestingly, I just read that the city was probably called Viipuri again for a few years during the Continuation War. The Finns retook the city in August 1941 but lost it again, and this time permanently, in June 1944 during the Vyborg–Petrozavodsk Offensive.

But then again, perhaps the two names have co-existed for centuries as Finns and Russians struggled for ownership of the area. Whichever name was official at a particular time was just a matter of which side owned it at that time; the winner would trot out its preferred name. Who knows, maybe it will be Viipuri again someday.

bru888 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 2:45 am

Mascarenhas wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 9:37 pm It's a pity, but I understand. You've a lot more to do. Keep up and cheers!

Perhaps you will accept as consolation Winter War 1940, now out in beta.

Of course, many thanks!

bru888 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:55 am

rafdobrowolski wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:36 am What port city is that? Looks like San Diego, California, where I live....

That's modern day Vyborg

I believe he was referring to the photo for your mod, unless that’s what you are referring to. I just think it odd that Finland would have so many aircraft carriers

bru888 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:55 am

rafdobrowolski wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:36 am What port city is that? Looks like San Diego, California, where I live....

That's modern day Vyborg

I believe he was referring to the photo for your mod, unless that’s what you are referring to. I just think it odd that Finland would have so many aircraft carriers

Zekedia222 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 12:31 pm

bru888 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:55 am

rafdobrowolski wrote: ↑Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:36 am What port city is that? Looks like San Diego, California, where I live....

That's modern day Vyborg

I believe he was referring to the photo for your mod, unless that’s what you are referring to. I just think it odd that Finland would have so many aircraft carriers

Oh! My bad.

And I can't remember where I got that carrier construction pic....sorry.
Its nice though