Slitherine

M4A3R3 Sherman "Zippo/Ronson" and M3 "Satan".
Powerful weapons against the Japanese bunkers.

Yes, I remember receiving this unit as a prize in one of the U.S. Pacific campaign - was it Iwo Jima? - and wishing that I had received it much sooner. I was like a vacuum cleaner of Japanese bunkers!

bru888 wrote:Yes, I remember receiving this unit as a prize in one of the U.S. Pacific campaign - was it Iwo Jima? - and wishing that I had received it much sooner. I was like a vacuum cleaner of Japanese bunkers!

US Pacific Campaign - Leyte or Okinawa, I don't remember
US Marines DLC - Iwo Jima (as a prize)

kondi754 wrote:

bru888 wrote:Yes, I remember receiving this unit as a prize in one of the U.S. Pacific campaign - was it Iwo Jima? - and wishing that I had received it much sooner. I was like a vacuum cleaner of Japanese bunkers!

US Pacific Campaign - Leyte or Okinawa, I don't remember
US Marines DLC - Iwo Jima (as a prize)

You can't buy Satans? kondi, you said you had two satans in the battles before Iwo. You get more as prizes?
I have this DLC so I will be doing the island hop too.

bru888 wrote:Yes, I remember receiving this unit as a prize in one of the U.S. Pacific campaign - was it Iwo Jima? - and wishing that I had received it much sooner. I was like a vacuum cleaner of Japanese bunkers!

Heh, faulty memory, Bruce. Right scenario but wrong campaign (U.S. Marines instead, and thanks, kondi754). This is how you get awarded the M4A3R3 Zippo tank in Iwo Jima: And, to my original point in this thread, take a look at this nuance and compare it to the regular Sherman tank. I am pretty sure that this would be a fuel canister for the flamethrower fuel: This is the regular Sherman tank: It was not all flames and roses manning this M4A3R3 Zippo, by the way. I ran across this in Wikipedia:

Crews of 'flame' tanks were not necessarily more vulnerable than those crews in the regular, standard version of the tank . . . but the crews of flamethrowing tanks were often treated differently should they be captured alive by enemy troops. Due to the perceived inhumanity of the weapon itself, captured crews of such tanks were often treated much less humanely than crews of regular tanks. Instances of 'flametankers' being executed by the opposite troops upon capture were not uncommon . . . Flame tanks also suffered from the fact, along with flamethrower-armed troops, that all enemy within range would usually open up on them due to the fear of the weapon.

GiveWarAchance wrote:

kondi754 wrote:

bru888 wrote:Yes, I remember receiving this unit as a prize in one of the U.S. Pacific campaign - was it Iwo Jima? - and wishing that I had received it much sooner. I was like a vacuum cleaner of Japanese bunkers!

US Pacific Campaign - Leyte or Okinawa, I don't remember
US Marines DLC - Iwo Jima (as a prize)

You can't buy Satans? kondi, you said you had two satans in the battles before Iwo. You get more as prizes?
I have this DLC so I will be doing the island hop too.

Well, below is the purchase "menu" from the start of Iwo Jima and both tanks are on there (LOL, it was just NOW, in this screen, that I notice the little flames on each of their gun barrels!). So, you would be able to purchase them for this last scenario but how much earlier in the U.S. Marines campaign, I don't know.

bru888 wrote:So, you would be able to purchase them for this last scenario but how much earlier in the U.S. Marines campaign, I don't know.

Actually, maybe I do know. If you look carefully in the units.csv file you see that the available date for the M4A3R3 Zippo tank is February 15, 1945. The only scenario in U.S. Marines which begins that late is the last one, Iwo Jima (begins February 19, 1945).
On the other hand, the M3 Satan tank is made available earlier (December 1, 1943) and it indeed is included as early as the Saipan scenario (June 15, 1944). This is the purchase "menu" from Saipan and you can see that the Satan is on there but not the Zippo:

Ah okay, so we can buy the beloved Satans in 43. That's a relief. The marines won't have to march up to powerful bunkers with only rifles, Thompsons and grenades to reduce them.
I'm on the last battle of Morning Sun which the briefing says is long & difficult. I play slow cause I tend to savor the game especially the rare opportunity to be the Japanese, and I also play Panzer Corp stuff too.

Bruce, you already completed Marines campaign for OOB? Have you played Marine Corp campaign for PanzerCorp? You are getting into Rising Sun campaign now? Can you use Yamato and Musashi BBs?

bru888 wrote: On the other hand, the M3 Satan tank is made available earlier (December 1, 1943) and it indeed is included as early as the Saipan scenario (June 15, 1944). This is the purchase "menu" from Saipan and you can see that the Satan is on there but not the Zippo:

You forgot about the Marshall Islands Scn, which was in January/February 1944. There, Satan appears for the first time.
I also noticed a fuel canister at the back of Zippo.

GiveWarAchance » 22 Jan 2017 19:03

You can't buy Satans? kondi, you said you had two satans in the battles before Iwo. You get more as prizes?
I have this DLC so I will be doing the island hop too.

[/quote]

Earlier improved ordinary Stuart to Satan version (with flamethrower), and I bought the second Satan . During the Battle of Iwo Jima got Sherman Zippo and had 3 "flame" tanks.

Is Zippo more deadly than the Satan? Is it named after zippo lighter?

GiveWarAchance wrote:Bruce, you already completed Marines campaign for OOB? Have you played Marine Corp campaign for PanzerCorp? You are getting into Rising Sun campaign now? Can you use Yamato and Musashi BBs?

When patch 2.9.9 came out, I went back and replayed U.S. Pacific. Then I played U.S. Marines (OOB, not PC) and after that, began the Japanese Grand Campaign. If you liked Morning Sun, you are going to really like Rising Sun. Morning Sun was fun but Rising Sun is more varied and interesting. Right now, I am about to start Brisbane, #10 out of 12 scenarios. I am still recovering from #9, New Caledonia. See if you agree that New Caledonia is the hardest scenario of the first nine in Rising Sun.

As far as the BB's, the units.csv file says the earliest version of the Yamato becomes available on December 16, 1941. I could find no reference to "Musashi." It appears that there are only three classes of Japanese battleships in the game: the Kongo, the Nagato, and the Yamato.

kondi754 wrote:You forgot about the Marshall Islands Scn, which was in January/February 1944. There, Satan appears for the first time.
I also noticed a fuel canister at the back of Zippo.

Yes, good catch. That's the one before the scenario that I was looking at, Saipan. The fuel canister is yet another example of somebody paying close attention to details in the artwork.

GiveWarAchance wrote:Is Zippo more deadly than the Satan? Is it named after zippo lighter?

Well, it makes sense that the Zippo would be more advanced than the Satan because the Zippo was basically a customized Sherman tank while the Satan was a Stuart tank and the Sherman was more powerful than the Stuart tank. Below is a side-by-side and the yellow strength numbers on the Zippo side bear this out. The Satan is quicker, that's all.
Regarding "Zippo," I am sure that there is a connection between the tank and the lighter. Zippo lighters were invented in the mid 1930s and, according to Wikipedia, "Zippo lighters became popular in the United States military, especially during World War II — when, as the company's web site says, Zippo 'ceased production of lighters for consumer markets and dedicated all manufacturing to the US military'."

Musashi is a powerful Yamato class BB, same as Yamato so maybe it will be in there somewhere but won't be a BB class of its own. That's why it took the entire carrier air force of Halsey so long to sink poor Musashi trying to get to Leyte

I don't have Rising Sun cause when I loaded up on Slitherine games at Christmas it was on a limited budget so can't get it for awhile now. Argh. I will get it when I can though. Anything to hear the roar of Yamato putting 18 inch shells downrange creating ridiculous carnage. So I'm limited to Marines DLC and Morning Sun for OOB plus what mods will work for me. I also got Allied Corp and Marine Corp for PanzerCorp and a little other stuff cause didn't know about OOB at that time cause it was a new discovery for me so got a campaign each of Japan and US to try it out.

LOoks like a lot of damage output for those fire tanks which is realistic. The flame weapon must have been similar with the Sherman maybe having more spray range historically with longer gun.
Thanks for showing the unit card info. Good to know I will have that toy for my next campaign.

I read somewhere a long time ago that the Shermans were nick-named zippos because they would light up when hit and destroyed by German tanks.

I checked google for clarity. Shermans were nicknamed Ronsons after a famous lighter because “Lights the first time, every time!”. But there are webpages that say that was a myth started after the war by the British, and Shermans actually had a lower brewing chance than all other tanks cause they had wet storage for the ammo from 1944.

The Zippo name is only for the flame version of the Sherman, and impressively for the game developers, it was only used on Iwo Jima exactly the same as in the Marine campaign for OOB.

Zippos also fought in Okinawa and were used during the Korean War.

kondi754 wrote:Zippos also fought in Okinawa and were used during the Korean War.

ya I should have said zippos started in Iwo and then after that

Take a good look at this Douglas A-20 Havoc because it's about to go down! (It's been bothering my support ships.) Scroll down for the control panel view.

The Douglas A-20 Havoc (company designation DB-7) was an American attack, light bomber, intruder aircraft of World War II . . . Although not the fastest or longest-range aircraft in its class, the Douglas DB-7 series distinguished itself as a tough, dependable combat aircraft with an excellent reputation for speed and maneuverability . . . Ex-pilots often consider it their favorite aircraft of the war due to the ability to toss it around like a fighter. The Douglas bomber/night fighter was extremely adaptable and found a role in every combat theater of the war, and excelled as a true "pilot's aeroplane."

The thing that caught my eye was the unique wing design. Looks sturdy. I wonder if that is what gave the plane added strength and maneuverability.

Hey, what the heck? For my 300th post, my avatar went from the respectable, although not very powerful, StuG IIIF tank to . . . Man on a Pony??

There was a window still open with my 299th post, so I was able to get pictures of both avatars:
I noticed the unit name is Kavallerie and of course I found an article in Wikipedia about the Kavallerie Brigade of the Waffen SS.
Umm, two things:
1. The unit is not in OOB for the Germans (only the Japanese, Chinese, Soviets, Poles, and Yugoslavians have cavalry units) and this is for the good because
2. The Kavallerie Brigade of the Waffen SS was engaged in some pretty nasty business according to Wikipedia.

Heh, so at this time, I would settle for "Horse Transport" as an avatar! Anybody know when the next avatar threshold is in terms of post count? Let me get busy . . .

Maybe your avatar is a just a horse of a different color.
Seems you are enjoying horsing around with that.

Live, from downtown Brooklyn (Australia)! The notorious DOOM TURTLE, also known as the T95 105 mm Gun Motor Carriage.
It is said that "This monstrosity carries a massive gun and is so heavy it requires a double set of tracks to move!"
But that's OK. I can counter with my Super Heavy Tank I/O. Where I got it, I don't know, but I am looking forward to a showdown duel! (Yeah, right. Both of these tubs are so slow that they will never reach each other before being dispatched by marines and AT guns.)