Slitherine

Cant see difference between different airplanes (for example)
Hs 129 - 21/12
Ju 87 -21/12
Blenheim - 21/12
Me 410 - 21/16

Swordfish - 19/16
P-40 - 19/16.

Why different types of airplanes have same value for Ground Defense/Air Defense ?

Ground defence is used against fire from ground units and naval units. For your aircraft, you will be attacked by AA units and by ground units with passive attack (passive attack is shown as [x] and means the unit will fire back if attacked but can't attack on your turn).

Air defence is used when attacked by aircraft (whether actively by fighters and fighter bombers or by a passive attack).

When Fighters and Tac bombers attack ground units, their defence against any defensive fire (neighbouring AA units and passive attack on the unit you are attacking) is reduced by 5 because they attack at very low altitude. This means that an AA unit firing at you on its turn will usually do less damage than when you are attacking. This is worth remembering when using your own AA units, as kills = experience and heroes. Defensive fire gets you more kills, especially as you can provide defensive fire for every attack as long as you have ammo. Attacking enemy planes can be useful but providing defence will usually develop your AA units faster.

Sorry dude, but I know what GD/AD mean. I asked about value of GD/AD - why different airplanes (light bomber Swordfish and fighter P-40) have equal GD/AD (19/16).

It's the way the designers viewed it. And for game balance.

Bi-plane hard to hit as it can move rapidly.

Fighter m have more armor and speed, but has to travel more in a straight line.

Yrfin wrote:Sorry dude, but I know what GD/AD mean. I asked about value of GD/AD - why different airplanes (light bomber Swordfish and fighter P-40) have equal GD/AD (19/16).

I can ask back, Why Not ?

Maybe a light Bomber is just as hard to Hit and to bring down than a fighter.
Maybe completely different variables add up to the Same value in the opinion of the designers.

You could as well ask why is a Mosquito Tac Bomber faster than most fighters.
Values are anything but carved in Stone just because some unit belongs to a certain class.
I'm pretty sure the Designers do their best to give a unit its own Profile, while having limited categories to accomplish the task. So whats the big deal if a swordfish ends up with 2 identical numbers as a P 40 ?
I mean at some point of the timeline we get Units that never saw real combat action and they still have to rank them into existing categories

Is this perfect ?
Probably not
Is the game playable and entertaining ?
Of course it is
Can there be more categories in the game to have more complexity ?
Without a doubt
Will it be more fun then ?
Not sure if there is a real good answer to the question

Take the Game for what it is
A turn based strategy Game will never be realistic in many regards and personally I don't care at all as long as I enjoy the gameplay

Razz1 wrote:It's the way the designers viewed it. And for game balance.

Bi-plane hard to hit as it can move rapidly.

Fighter m have more armor and speed, but has to travel more in a straight line.

Sound good, but I cant understand game-designers views. From my point of views, its looking very unbalanced: heavy armored Hs 129 have same GD/AD like unarmored Ju 87 (21/12). Of course i understand, PzC is not flight simulator, but in case ground units its clear: Pz I have 14 mm armor and have 6 GD, Pz III have 30 mm armor and 8 GD. Clear. Simple formula. But in case airplanes - its looking like "hmm.. I forget balance GD/AD for airplanes".

So, I just hope find answer: is it exist formula/or table (like for ground units): for example light bi-plane bomber have 10 GD, ordinary fighter-12 GD, heavy bombers - 14 GD and so on.

Yrfin wrote:

Razz1 wrote:It's the way the designers viewed it. And for game balance.

Bi-plane hard to hit as it can move rapidly.

Fighter m have more armor and speed, but has to travel more in a straight line.

Sound good, but I cant understand game-designers views.

Discussing why game designers chose specific values 5 years after the game was released is pointless. If you have a differing opinion then by all means edit the equipment.pzeqp file to your liking. It's soo easy to mod this game.

I dont care why game designers choose specific values, i just want understand logic of choose. Too many features of game mechanics hidden from me, and i looking answers from gamers, not from designes.

And yes, i can edit e-file, and I modified it for all my ground units from my point of view (except AA units).
But when I start tweaking air units, im stop in confusion.
What I see:
All airplanes of 3 classes (Luftwaffe for example) have GD in range 20-22. No much differences (in my point of view). So, GD mean nothing for aiplanes different classes ? Ok, lets see same class. Pure fighter Fw 190A have same GD (21) like specialized ground attack version Fw 190F ? Why Fw 190D-9 have GD -1 (20) compare with Fw 190A (21)? Have armored specialized ground attack Hs 129 have GD 21 like unarmores slowly Ju 87 (21), but analog Hs 129 in Soviets Il-2 have GD 23, and more armored Il-10 - GD 22 ? Same in case AD. I cant see logic in it, but maybe here is hidden features ?

Yrfin wrote:I dont care why game designers choose specific values, i just want understand logic of choose.

This sentence doesn't make sense. They chose specific value for a reason - in other words there's logic behind it.

And how can it be a "hidden" feature where all those values can be read from the unit card in game?

How can be hidden ? I dont know. Designers known.
And about "logic" and "for reason".
For example Bf 109E for some reason have AA 14 (i dont know why 14 not 144) (2xMG+2xCannon).
Bf 109F have AA 12 - 2xMG and 1xCannon. Logical ? Yes.
But Bf 110C have AA 10 (4xMG+2xCannon). Logical ? No. So what was designes "for reason" in this case ? "Game balance" or somthing else ? I dont know.

Yrfin wrote:For example Bf 109E for some reason have AA 14 (i dont know why 14 not 144) (2xMG+2xCannon).
Bf 109F have AA 12 - 2xMG and 1xCannon. Logical ? Yes.
But Bf 110C have AA 10 (4xMG+2xCannon). Logical ? No. So what was designes "for reason" in this case ? "Game balance" or somthing else ? I dont know.

Maybe the 110C was less agile than others?? (don't know), so it could not use its superior weapons as often?