Slitherine

i've been trying to narrow down some kind of allergic reaction i've been having, and it's looking increasingly like it's superglue.

a tiny whiff and my nose runs, a lot.

no drama though. i just need a recommendation for another glue to use.

anyone?

Wow, I've never heard of anyone being allergic to cyanoacrylate before. Other than the kind of allergic reaction I have when I glue my fingers together

It really depends on what you're doing of course. If you're talking about basing then I often use a two-part epoxy. It's pretty tough and works on most surfaces. It does tend to be sticky and thicker by comparison though. If you're talking about assembling miniatures with multiple parts then it might not be so appropriate.

Silly question - you ARE working in a well ventilated room aren't you?

Edit: Just found the following thanks to Google. I have NO IDEA how accurate it is but the suggestions for odour free glues mught help...

<quote>
Some people are extremely allergic to the polymer reaction fumes given off by the curing of CA glues. If you experience 'bad' headaches from use (even momentary use) of CA glues, you might be allergic. The CA allergy appears to be cumulative as well, i.e. the longer you use CA, the worse your allergy get to CA. If you are allergic, don't despair, first try some of the 'Foam Safe', UFO, or odorless types of CA. If the same thing happens, try using Aliphatic glues (Elmers, etc.). I've never heard of anyone who's reported to be allergic to those glues, and they can be really strong and lighter anyway (when used properly).
</quote>

Millsy wrote:Wow, I've never heard of anyone being allergic to cyanoacrylate before. Other than the kind of allergic reaction I have when I glue my fingers together

That's nothing. I once glued myself to a tube of cyanoacrylate, and then when I tried to use the debonding stuff, I managed to glue myself to the debonder too.

That's nothing. I once glued myself to a tube of cyanoacrylate, and then when I tried to use the debonding stuff, I managed to glue myself to the debonder too.

Sorry but i have not laughed like that for while after i read that

Of course having a tube of super glue in your jeans and sitting on them is not great either, did you know the stuff expands in heat I really liked those jeans.

But if it is just for basing filler is good.

Millsy wrote:Wow, I've never heard of anyone being allergic to cyanoacrylate before. Other than the kind of allergic reaction I have when I glue my fingers together

It really depends on what you're doing of course. If you're talking about basing then I often use a two-part epoxy. It's pretty tough and works on most surfaces. It does tend to be sticky and thicker by comparison though. If you're talking about assembling miniatures with multiple parts then it might not be so appropriate.

Silly question - you ARE working in a well ventilated room aren't you?

Edit: Just found the following thanks to Google. I have NO IDEA how accurate it is but the suggestions for odour free glues mught help...

i'm experiencing a severely runny nose after using the stuff, and the room i'm in is large enough to not concentrate the fumes. but, i'm hunched over the table when i'm gluing figures/fingers/brushes together.

for basing i just use PVA. has worked well enough until now.

i'll try the two-part epoxy, or look for the odour-free superglue.

You'll find the epoxy might well pong a fair bit too. At least you'll get some variety in the smells! When I mentioned the epoxy I only meant for attaching the figs BTW. I just use PVA for attacking sand and other decoration too.

Since we're kinda talking about modelling accidents, I once knifed myself in the leg when my table partly collapsed. I made a pretty darn good job of it and I've still got the scar. I like to think of it as "suffering for my art"...

all good fun with superglue. I found a good glue. It's bostic all purpose. It's not as strong as superglue when you apply it, but it dries really well. The only problem is it is very, erm, gooey and so you have to be really gentle when you squeeze it out or your miniature will look like a snot covered hoplite or some kind of wierd shoggoth creation for all of you HP lovecraft lovers out there.

I use the two-part epoxy resin too (is it UHU?), mainly for sticking riders onto horses and figures onto
bases - although perhaps I shouldn't as it seems so strong re-basing could be a nightmare. The main
problem is it takes a while to dry, so I use superglue for and weapons and shields.

Runny nose may be more irritation from the fumes rather than an allergy (like chopping onions),
especially if you are leaning over the work. You could try putting a fan off to one side to gently
push the air away. You can't really do it under water like with onions

prinny wrote:

That's nothing. I once glued myself to a tube of cyanoacrylate, and then when I tried to use the debonding stuff, I managed to glue myself to the debonder too.

Sorry but i have not laughed like that for while after i read that

The best part was wandering around the office trying to get someone to open the debonder so I could squirt some of the stuff on my hands and free myself - but no-one could, because they were all too busy laughing...

peterrjohnston wrote:I use the two-part epoxy resin too (is it UHU?), mainly for sticking riders onto horses and figures onto
bases - although perhaps I shouldn't as it seems so strong re-basing could be a nightmare. The main
problem is it takes a while to dry, so I use superglue for and weapons and shields.

Runny nose may be more irritation from the fumes rather than an allergy (like chopping onions),
especially if you are leaning over the work. You could try putting a fan off to one side to gently
push the air away. You can't really do it under water like with onions

If I get too close to superglue my eyes will water and my nose will run too but if I hold the glue out about a foot and a half from me I don't have any problems.

peterrjohnston wrote:I use the two-part epoxy resin too (is it UHU?), mainly for sticking riders onto horses and figures onto
bases - although perhaps I shouldn't as it seems so strong re-basing could be a nightmare. The main
problem is it takes a while to dry, so I use superglue for and weapons and shields.

Runny nose may be more irritation from the fumes rather than an allergy (like chopping onions),
especially if you are leaning over the work. You could try putting a fan off to one side to gently
push the air away. You can't really do it under water like with onions

yeah, this is run, then clog, then run for about a week.

i should probably stay well away from the stuff.

When using superglue to base figures, I put a drop of white glue (Elmers type) on the base and a small drop of superglue on the figure. The water in the white glue sets the superglue very quickly, and I use much less than when I was using superglue alone. I also find the thickest 'gap filling' type of super glue has fewer fumes.

I registered just to say: I'm having the exact same symptoms! Runny / clogged nose for a few days after extensive gluing using Super Attack or the glue produced by Games Workshop (rumour has it its the same substance, and they both contains Cyanacrylate). Started out mildly but has become quite a nuisance recently, and the long term effects are worrying.

I'm going to try the odorless type, and the other things mentioned by Millsy (thanks, by the way).

Any of the alternative stuff that worked for you?

//Seto

setomidor wrote:I registered just to say: I'm having the exact same symptoms! Runny / clogged nose for a few days after extensive gluing using Super Attack or the glue produced by Games Workshop (rumour has it its the same substance, and they both contains Cyanacrylate). Started out mildly but has become quite a nuisance recently, and the long term effects are worrying.

I'm going to try the odorless type, and the other things mentioned by Millsy (thanks, by the way).

Any of the alternative stuff that worked for you?

//Seto

i haven't used superglue (or any other glue) for a month or so. i thought that maybe it was the dust of the white metal, but i've worked with the same figures (and paints) and no reaction.

so, this suggests it is the glue.

i'm going to try some epoxy glue tomorrow, and if that doesn't produce a reaction, i'll just have to stick with that.

I've ordered some of the odurless AC glue and hopefully I'll start expose myself to the substance sometime at the end of the week.

setomidor wrote:I've ordered some of the odurless AC glue and hopefully I'll start expose myself to the substance sometime at the end of the week.

let us know how it goes. i've tried using superglue with a fan running to disperse the odours. so far, so good.

(tried epoxy resins and they were a waste of time)

I bought a bottle of odorless AC glue, and I'm feeling much better despite gluing together 100+ models since! The bonding time is slightly longer for this particular glue, but that's a trade off that I'm willing to do

setomidor wrote:I bought a bottle of odorless AC glue, and I'm feeling much better despite gluing together 100+ models since! The bonding time is slightly longer for this particular glue, but that's a trade off that I'm willing to do

might have to try it. i glued a single figure together yesterday and my nostril was tingling. definitely superglue.

have been using uhu, and it's shitty. lots of waste, doesn't always bond well. epoxy was worst.

Proper two-component epoxy (like Araldite) require a while to bond - like, 2 hours for initial bonding and up to 20 hours for the matrix to form. Once this is set, however, it is more likely you'll manage to pull the pewter apart than the epoxy.

Some epoxy variants can be cured by UV light exposure and set much faster. They are also very strong.

If you have the patience and don't require the rapid but fairly weak bonding of cyanoacrylate superglues, I'd recommend trying epoxy again.

I tried this,

http://www.warglue.co.uk/about-war-glue/info_8.html

It was outstanding. And there are even some ugly wargamers on the testimonials page that agree with me.

It is expensive though