Slitherine

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2012 6:34 pm**

Hi

I started playing the 39' DLC after the new patch with the new units.

I reached Norway and a bunch of new units became available. Im pretty sure that one of the was a glider

But when i tried to purchase the units it wasnt there.

How does it work?

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2012 6:51 pm**

Transports such as Ju 52 air transport or DFS 230 glider are not purchasable. They are used once you embark an unit from an airport, but only if the scenario settings allows air transports or gliders. You can hover the mouse over embark/disembark button and you will get a tooltip about what kind of transport and how many you can use in the current scenario. I presume gliders can't be used in in any of the DLC campaigns because they were designed before the introduction of gliders.

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2012 7:08 pm**

Ok thx.

Just seems a bit odd that the game show it as a new avavaile unit if you cant purchase it or use it at all. The cost of the glider showed 200 something prestige in cost.

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:49 pm**

I could probably remove non-organic transports from "new equipment" list if everyone agrees?

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:03 pm**

Rudankort wrote:I could probably remove non-organic transports from "new equipment" list if everyone agrees?

hmmm..on the other hand people get to know that they are available now and dont have to find out by accident when hovering over the tooltip...in fall of 1944

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:07 pm**

Another question about gliders. I just arrived at the AK Malta scenario. According to the embarkation tooltip, I have gliders available--but when I deploy a unit in one of the deployment hexes, it appears in a naval transport. Is there a way to deploy a unit in the air in a glider? If not, how does one use them?

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:43 pm**

Ditto, I can't figure out how to load dudes in gliders. Maybe you can only do it at an airfield? Of course then they're no different than air transport.

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:51 pm**

robman wrote:Another question about gliders. I just arrived at the AK Malta scenario. According to the embarkation tooltip, I have gliders available--but when I deploy a unit in one of the deployment hexes, it appears in a naval transport. Is there a way to deploy a unit in the air in a glider? If not, how does one use them?

AgentTBC wrote:Ditto, I can't figure out how to load dudes in gliders. Maybe you can only do it at an airfield? Of course then they're no different than air transport.

I had the same question but in version 1.10 it is not possible to deploy other units than paratroopers in airtransport:

zappel wrote:
uran21 wrote:
zappel wrote:And what do you think about changing the sort order of airtransport to use the smallest available airtransport instead of the biggest?
Well what is the smallest and what is the biggest here? We have glider categorized as light and heavy and it is always better to list light before heavy because heavy can carry everything light one can and even more. But ordinary air transport works differently. It will disembark only paratroopers anywhere on the map and those who can use airlift only on the airfield. So lets say you want to mount Gebirgsjäger to be disembarked somewhere on the mountains. If Ju52 is listed first it will load a unit but it can disembark it only on an airfield. On the other hand if light glider is listed first it will carry Gebirgsjäger or paratrooper if you want to use them instead.
That's true - for combat phase. But in deployment phase only paratroopers can be assigned in airtransport. In this case the gliders (cause they are first in line) are used. Gebirgsjäger can be deployed on an airfiled but not in an airtransport. So the paratroopers use the "bigger" tranpsort and the Gebirgsjäger (or light artillery or AA or ...) can in the first turn only be mounted in the "smaller" air transport and can only be lifted to another airfield.
Perhaps a mix could solve this issue: let Fallschirmjäger always first mount in JU52 if available?
Or another proposal: in PG the Embark/Disembark button was used in deployment phase to assign how units will be deployed: as ground unit or in airtransport.
Maybe this can be a change for the next version (> 1.10)?

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 6:16 pm**

So basically the gliders do nothing?

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 6:43 pm**

Let me see if I understand correctly: The game engine is currently set up to load units (except paratroops without ground transport) onto the heaviest/largest transport option available at deployment. In the Malta scenario, there are three possibilities--glider, Junkers, naval--of which naval is the heaviest/largest. Since there are 30 empty naval transport slots available for the deployment of less than 30 units (24 + SE), available naval transports never run out, so deployment onto glider never becomes an option. Is that right?

If that's right, would the simplest fix be to change the number of available naval transports to the real number the player wants to use? Or is it possible to move gliders ahead of naval transports in the "boot sequence"?

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 6:55 pm**

AgentTBC wrote:So basically the gliders do nothing?

No, they do something. If you move a ground unit to an airfield it can use gliders as aitrtransport. They are much better than Ju52 because you can disembark any unit wherever you want, not only over an airfield. That's great. But it is a pity that unit can't be deployed in a glider, you have to deploy them on an airfield-hex and in the first turn you can embark this unit.

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 7:00 pm**

zappel wrote:But it is sad that unit can't be deployed in a glider, you have to deploy them on an airfield-hex and in the first turn you can embark this unit.

But in Malta, there are no airfields at the beginning of the scenario, and 3 of the 5 available gliders are loaded with auxiliary units. At first glance, it seems like the designers' intention would have been to make the other two available at deployment, rather than leaving them solely for subsequent island-hopping (especially since three would probably suffice for that purpose). Any official comment?

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 7:05 pm**

robman wrote:Let me see if I understand correctly: The game engine is currently set up to load units (except paratroops without ground transport) onto the heaviest/largest transport option available at deployment. In the Malta scenario, there are three possibilities--glider, Junkers, naval--of which naval is the heaviest/largest. Since there are 30 empty naval transport slots available for the deployment of less than 30 units (24 + SE), available naval transports never run out, so deployment onto glider never becomes an option. Is that right?

I found no way to deploy any unit except paratroopers in airtransport. On the other side I also found no way to deploy paratroopers as a ground unit or in seatransport.

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 7:46 pm**

(1) In the stand-alone Malta scenario, all five gliders are loaded at the outset, which suggests that the player should be able to deploy two more of his own choosing at the outset of the campaign scenario.

(2) I tried reducing the number of naval transports in the "Malta" scenario, but it had no effect on the campaign scenario, the number remained stuck at 30--so I don't know if this trick could work or not.

(3) Zappel: You can deploy paratroopers on the ground at the beginning of a scenario if (a) air transports are not available or (b) they do have organic land transport assigned to them already.

Posted: **Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:06 pm**

Gotcha, Malta was confusing me since it seemed like you should be able to deploy a couple guys in gliders at the beginning. The battle isn't really long enough to make loading them in later very effective.

Posted: **Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:53 pm**

Two questions for the developers:

(1) Is the inability to load units onto the two remaining gliders at the beginning of the campaign-mode Malta scenario a glitch, or by design?

(2) If it is a glitch, can the user make them available by editing some file or other? If so, how exactly?

Many thanks!

Posted: **Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:52 pm**

I would agree with the idea presented by Rudankort to keep non-organic (i.e. "not purchaseable") transports out of the new equipment available report.

Posted: **Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:00 pm**

Ok, I hate to beat a dead horse but are the gliders actually working? I'm in the Palestine scenario where I have some DFS 230 and JU 52 available, but I cannot load stuff onto gliders even from my airfields. Is there something I can read to describe the different glider types and how to use them?

Posted: **Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:05 pm**

Pardon me, I meant the Syria scenario. Not Palestine. Shouldn't I be able to load anything with the "glider" attribute in the equipment file on a glider?

Posted: **Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:50 pm**

AgentTBC wrote:Shouldn't I be able to load anything with the "glider" attribute in the equipment file on a glider?

I do not think. There are two types of gliders: light and heavy. In the light glider you can load only "light" units like infantery or for example the 15 cm Nblwf 41 (without transport), other units like the 21 cm Nblwf 42 needs the heavy glider to be transported. But I don't know how this is represented in the equipment file.

Slitherine

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