Slitherine

Greetings:

Prior to Slitherine's bombshell, PAW had decided that if V2 was not in print by Christmas, we would go with v1 in February, but would use v2 if it was available early enough.

We are now undecided about the future of our FOG competition in February, and are polling regular attendees for their opinions.

Just in case he has missed anyone, here's what umpire Andy Clark has sent out to previous competitors:

We are in a bit of a quandary following the recent announcement from Slitherine about FoG v2.

Your thoughts would be welcome, as we have a decision to make.

We can:-

1) Stick with FoG v1 (though some people, by then, would have used v2 for over 6 months).
2) Go with v2, knowing not everyone has an Ipad!
3) Try another set, DBM (3.2) DBMM (2) , or some other rule set.
4) With a FoG schism seeming inevitable, not hold an ancients comp. this year.

Would be interested to hear any views on this

Anyone who is planning to come to PAW2013 for the FOG competitions, feel free to contact Andy Clark (albion1 on this forum) with their viewpoint.

I have posted a similar entry to the PAW2013 support site, which includes a link to Andy's email address for those that don't have it already.

Greetings:

PAW have decided that we will definitely run the FOGAM 25mm competition, using version 1 if there is no printed version 2 available by Christmas, version 2 otherwise.

Feedback about the 15mm competition has been quite low. We have actually had more requests to run FOGN than anything else! FOGR has also been suggested

Whilst this isn't quite the forum to ask, can anyone who would be interested in FOGN or FOGR in 15mm at the PAW show in February please express an interest in this thread, or using the contacts mentioned in the previous post.

johno

I intend to participate in the 25mm FOG am again next year, but only if its v.1.

I have no technology capable of processing the v2 as published and even if I did I think its well out of order not offerring the product in hard copy so would be reluctant to pander to it in my own very minor way and thumb my nose at the users of paper. I'm only sad that you can't get the rules in mediaeval illuminated manuscript parchment format... or cunieform clay tablet...

I would also like to see 15mm FOGR on offer. If there was a choice between 25mm FOGAm and 15mm FOGR (depending on the theme chosen) then I would be in an agony of indecision as to which to go for, but would opt for one or the other.

Martyn (25mm Alexandrian Macedonian in 2012)

V2 is going to be done hard copy now

Ahhh, splendid ! How's that for rapid reaction to customer feedback ?

AlexandersChiefEunuch wrote:Ahhh, splendid ! How's that for rapid reaction to customer feedback ?

They have also said that both will be released at the same time. Which has delayed the release of the digital version

AlexandersChiefEunuch wrote:I intend to participate in the 25mm FOG am again next year, but only if its v.1.

I have no technology capable of processing the v2 as published and even if I did I think its well out of order not offerring the product in hard copy so would be reluctant to pander to it in my own very minor way and thumb my nose at the users of paper.

If you look closely at my post, you will see that the PAW 2013 25mm Ancients will be version 1 unless version 2 is available in a printed format before Christmas 2012

So either there will be a printed version (which we now expect to happen), or we will run with version 1.

We live in the far south west, one of the poorest paid yet most expensive to live in regions of the country.

The Plymouth club struggles to find a laptop between us to use for recording results between rounds, so we're not going to use anything that requires tablets or laptops for all players!

The 15mm period is now confirmed as FoG Napoleonic at 800 points - there weren't enough expressions of interest in a FoGR competition to warrant running it, I'm afraid.

johno

Just a confirmation that the PAW 2013 FoG Ancients competition is in 25mm, using version 2 of the rules
Details are here:

http://www.paw2013.co.uk/index.php/comp ... ients.html

There will be no 15mm Ancients competition in 2013, but there will be a 15mm Napoleonic competition.
Details are here:

http://www.paw2013.co.uk/index.php/comp ... w2013.html

John

We have acceded to the many requests to reinstall Ancients 15mm competition to PAW 2013.

Therefore we now will have 3 Field of Glory competitions.

a) Field of Glory Napoleonic 15mm

b) Field of Glory Ancients 15mm

c) Field of Glory Ancients 25mm

Full details on our web site.

http://www.plymouthwargamers.co.uk/

Any decision on v1 /v2 yet?

thanks

No change since August - which means that since a paper Version 2 is available for Christmas, then version 2 it is.

johno

Yes, it was a close run thing but as John said on Christmas Eve, version 2 it is.
650 points for 25mm, 800 points for 15mm and both on 6 x 4 tables.
All you need to know here http://www.paw2013.co.uk/

So who's going?

Berkeley Vale will have their usual contingent less Mike who's been snookered by his brother's 50th and Keith who's not on for such a long distance anymore. We've found a reasonable substitute though in Mr Fry.

I have entered the 25mm Ancients competition with Mayan.

Richard Jeffrey-Cook

Excellent! Look forward to seeing you, Richard.

I'll have my SOA subs in my hand, ready to start my 4th decade of membership!

John

lionheartrjc wrote:I have entered the 25mm Ancients competition with Mayan.

Richard Jeffrey-Cook

See you there Richard. Mayan sound fun, I know the Tupin were value entertainment when I used them 2 years ago in the 15mm event.

Steve P

Excellent tournament this weekend at Plymouth. 10 competitors for the 25mm competition and 8 competitors for the 15mm competition.
Thanks to Andy Clark for his organisation.

My Mayans had a great time in the 25mm competition, beating Wars of the Roses, Seleucid and Ancient British armies (a favourable draw!) and drawing with Later Crusaders by hiding in the terrain! Version 2 rules worked really well (I guess I am biased!). PAW 2014 is on 1st/2nd February 2014 and is a great event. Make the trip to Plymouth - it is worthwhile.

Richard Jeffrey-Cook

Indeed , many thanks to Andy and the Plymouth gang for hosting a good fun show.

My games weren't quite as successful and I lost my lovefor FOG a bit on Sunday.

I took Seleucids. I also took Scythed Chariots. Never again. Completely useless. also took Companions in two 2base BGs, never again, too brittle to be front line troops.

Great game Saturday morning with a 25-0 win vs Later Carthaginians.

Deployed badly on Sat pm vs Richard's Mayans (lionheartrjc above) and got taught an important lesson; I was fixated on being out by 3.30 to watch the rugby but as we started early should have thought about it more, spread too wide, shot to bits on way in, lost every shooting CT, went in in penny packets, lost impact, lost melee lost game. Cats did save some pride and wiped a unit of bow.

Sunday morning vs ABs, wide open space vs more MF and chariots. Remembering the priot Mayan game I deployed narrow and relatively deep. The ABs back peddle whilst I thundered forward. Scyhted Chariots hit and do the job, yippee... oh no I move HF 3 MUs, it take two turns to hit, he rallies from Frag'd to ok, I hot perfectly happy medium IF and lose the Impact, drop and lose then melee and drop. Cue pike route. No better on left, 1 companion BG routs to LH javelin shots, the other implodes on Impact vs the elite medium IF leaving my nellie overlapped. Cats help out but it's not enough. On my right the Thorakitai and other nellies do well vs more MF and light chariots but he just will not break. My army implodes after more poor dice. My opponent was so nervous as my line hit he played for time and went for fag break, then Lady Luck spat in my face and kicked me in the nuts...

Game 4 vs Early French, lots of Cavalry. More dream terrain, narrow and tight again. With nothing to lose he advances fast and hits my left, 2 companion BGs, Nellies, Scythed Chariots, Cat in position to turn flank... What could go wrong? Yep, Companions imploded on Death Roll, 1 in impact the other routed in melee after having lost CT for seeing mates break. Leaving Nellies to hold out whilst my catsmanaged to tage 1 enemy bg... On the right my OfSp are caught by cavalry in open after having to charge LF, but it's ok I have nellies coming to support, I'm wider, armoured, I can hold. Nope drop in impact and double dropped in melee.

At this point I called it a day and packed up; we fought out my next Cats impact in my next turn to see if I managed to get a 2nd bg but I didnit. Another series of losing nigh on all impacts and melees despite more dice and better POAs lost my line in 2 turns. The pikes were too slow to advance with the new limited TC.

So 4 BGs that imploded on a Death Roll of 1 is not a good idea when your break is 9. I'd considered this but put faith in Elite companions winning most combats in favourable matches. They didn't, bar the first game my Companions never won a combat!! They imploded and left the nellies isolated who despite good work could not hold back the tide when overlapped.

Indeed, I have found Scythed Chariots largely useless in FoG - although I am convinced that they were rarely effective in history. Personally I think I would boost their effect at impact (possibly an additional POA vs undrilled troops?). I would also take away their ability to provide rear support! Nothing too drastic, but enough.

BGs of 2 are extremely vulnerable - even when using Elites. I have made them work with an IC and avoid melees in all but the most favourable circumstances. 1 BG of 4 elite is far more effective than 2BGs of 2 in many circumstances.

Don't fall out of love with FoG - learn from your games and do better next time!

Richard

stenic wrote:Sunday morning vs ABs, wide open space vs more MF and chariots. Remembering the priot Mayan game I deployed narrow and relatively deep. The ABs back peddle whilst I thundered forward. Scyhted Chariots hit and do the job, yippee... oh no I move HF 3 MUs, it take two turns to hit, he rallies from Frag'd to ok, I hot perfectly happy medium IF and lose the Impact, drop and lose then melee and drop. Cue pike route. No better on left, 1 companion BG routs to LH javelin shots, the other implodes on Impact vs the elite medium IF leaving my nellie overlapped. Cats help out but it's not enough. On my right the Thorakitai and other nellies do well vs more MF and light chariots but he just will not break. My army implodes after more poor dice. My opponent was so nervous as my line hit he played for time and went for fag break, then Lady Luck spat in my face and kicked me in the nuts...

Sounds like you deployed sensibly - you had quality to his quantity so should be able to overmatch the ABs in one area.

But your description of what happened subsequently suggests that your army might have got spread out and some of your small units got isolated, or matched against the enemy's best troops (I may of course be mis-reading). I do agree those two base units are very fragile so I find you need to be very careful with them. I've played against them and they look scary right up until the point when they are fighting their two bases against the enemy four bases and then they die.

I would be tempted to get the pike into action alongside the cataphracts, and use the elephants and companions next to them two deep.

The chariots might be better as a delaying force while your main punch goes in elsewhere perhaps?