Slitherine

Hi, I don't know if I am being particularly thick, but the headline news for the Slitherine site today is Field of Glory goes 2.0.
The information gives the impression (if I have read it right) that Ancients and Medievel v 2.0 has been released and is available for the ipad.
I have been wondering about getting this game for a while now and I would certainly buy it immediately for the ipad.

I discovered Battle Academy for the iPad in May and then went straight for Panzer Corps on the PC. I am loosing my life to PanzerC.
I just love this Slitherine site and the support it gives to its game community. Is the V 2.0 available on the PC and should I consider getting the game first on the PC anyway? Is there someone on here who plays both Panzer Corps and Field of Glory, who can compare the two and let me know what to expect.

Have the graphics been improved since its first release? Not a big issue as Panzer Corps graphics aren't amazing either, and that game rocks.....

The headline relates to the tabletop rules, and their new iPad incarnation I believe. There is indeed work ongoing to rebuild and modernise the FoG game engine so I can see how it might be confusing!

The new version of the digital game is being worked on feverishly as we speak and an iPad version would probably be a safe bet at some point, but sadly not today.

Cheers

Pip

Here are the new changes to the tabletop rules:-


CHANGEs in Version 2
Many clarifications made to wording.

Skirmishers less slippery, with reduced ability to slow enemy movement and less ability to concentrate shooting without risk.
Shooting range reduced to 3 MU for LH (and single-ranked cavalry) with bow.
Effective range reduced to 3 MU for LF with bow, longbow, crossbow or sling.
Evaders cannot turn at any table edge to avoid evading off the table.
Second moves can go to just beyond 4 MUs of enemy skirmishers.
Turn and move and expand and move – distance reduced by 2 MUs.

Drilled troops less manoeuvrable and undrilled troops less unmanoeuvrable:
Move with 90 degree turn or expansion reduced by 2 MUs.
Turn, retired and turn again move reduced to 2 MU, but also possible for single ranked non-shock cavalry, camelry, chariots.
No wheel or double wheel can exceed a total of 90 degrees.
Wheeling/short-moving by Other Undrilled without a commander only complex within 4 MUs of any enemy skirmishers or 6 MUs of any other enemy (including the enemy camp but not an enemy commander’s base).
Undrilled other troops with a general can make a stationary 90 or 180 degree turn without taking a CMT.

Move Distances:
Movement distances of HF increased in Uneven and Difficult.
Armoured Knights move distances increased to same as Cavalry.
Elephants move increased in Difficult.
Heavy Artillery can pivot.
Bonus movement distances for columns in terrain removed.
FRAGMENTED troops have their maximum movement distance reduced by 1 MU (after any other deductions). However, they do not need to take a CMT to move.

Very large (“swarm”) armies easier to break:
Break point of army cannot exceed the total points value of the army divided by 50, rounded up. (e.g. 16 in the case of an 800 point army).
Battle troops (i.e. Cavalry, Camelry, Light Chariots) which evade of table count as 2 attrition points.

Commanders limited in how many battle groups they can command as a battle line – making Field Commanders more worthwhile:
A Troop Commander cannot command a battle line of more than 2 battle groups.
A Field Commander cannot command a battle line of more than 4 battle groups.
An Inspired Commander cannot command a battle line of more than 6 battle groups.
Commanders cannot affect the re-rolls of scythed chariots and artillery.
Only commanders depicted on elephants (and so specified in the special instructions to their army list) can affect the re-rolls of elephants.
Commanders depicted on elephants cannot affect the re-rolls of other mounted troops.

Interpenetration anomalies prevented:
Leapfrogging prevented.
“Teleport” interpenetrations prevented.

Elephants improved:
Get 3 dice per base in impact combat.

Shooting:
Ranges changed as above.
Non-single-ranked Protected and Unprotected cavalry less vulnerable to shooting.
Crossbows (and longbows) get + POA vs non-single-ranked Protected and Armoured cavalry.
Support shooting no longer on a - POA.

Close combat effects of superior armour reduced:
A single level of armour advantage does not give a + POA if this would result in an overall ++ POA.
This means that Barbarian foot are no longer a walkover for Romans.

Changes to rules for rear support and routing make historical multi-line formations more viable:
Rear Support:
Bases from other BGs do not have to all be directly behind the supported BG – bases in edge contact with such bases also count.
After the initial rout, routers can
Shift up to 2 base widths to avoid friends etc.
Pass through friendly drilled troops as a permitted interpenetration. [Hence they don’t drop cohesion].

Ability of high quality troops to keep fighting despite heavy losses reduced:
CT modifier of -1 for each 25% of original strength lost.
Broken battle groups at or below 50% of their original strength cannot be rallied, and are removed at the end of the JAP.

Restricted area:
Any battle group capable of doing so can move straight back perpendicular to its own rear. A battle group in the restricted area of enemy even partly behind it rear can move straight forwards. These moves are permitted even if the battle group ends its move no longer in front of the enemy battle group.
Moves by pinned battle groups can include contraction of files that are not in any restricted area.

Cohesion test:
First three Cohesion Test modifiers altered to:
Battle group suffered at least 1 HP2B from shooting or close combat -1
Battle group testing for losing impact phase combat -1
Battle group testing for losing melee phase combat in which it received at least 2 more hits than it inflicted -1
Modifier for losses is now -1 for each 25% lost.
Extra -1 modifier if testing for seeing C-in-C lost.
Heavy chariots inflict a -1 CT modifier on enemy they beat at impact. (Like lancers in V1)

Set-up rules:
Cataphract camels don’t count towards initiative modifiers.
The player winning the pre-battle initiative roll can choose whether to keep the initiative or pass it over to his opponent. (Thus getting to move first).
Player without initiative chooses his terrain pieces first.
Roads are placed last during terrain set-up so that they cannot be used to block other terrain placement.
1 extra Brush added to Steppe territory.
Terrain “touching side edge” can touch river instead.
Deployment area for non-skirmishers increased to 12 MUs from long table edge.
Flank Marches: Any battle groups that cannot fit onto the table on the turn of arrival will never arrive and count as straggling.
Dismounted heavily armoured knights have HW capability.

Other miscellaneous changes:
Wheel in a charge must be at the start of the charge and direction is declared before any charge responses are declared.
New rule prevents enemy from blocking turns.
VMD not taken into account when decided whether shock troops need to test not to charge.
Skirmishers MUST evade non-skirmishers in the open.
FRAGGed troopscharged in flank or rear which would drop a cohesion level on impact, instead break immediately without testing or waiting to be contacted.
A move into contact with the enemy camp is treated as a charge. As such, it can be intercepted.
Only foot battle troops can sack a fortified camp.
A battle group that did not charge this move is not required to conform if doing so will expose it to a flank or rear charge by an enemy battle group next turn (unless a flank or rear charge by that battle group is possible even if it does not conform).
Heavy weapon capability no longer cancelled by skilled swordsmen or skirmishers.
Foot defending field fortifications (but not portable defences) need not pursue broken enemy.
Field Fortifications:
If any are used, the army must have at least 4 base-widths of them.
Troops must have front or side edge touching FF to count defending.
Battle groups facing in more than one direction (including those in orb or in a “kinked” column) cannot claim rear support.
“Kinked” columns cannot intercept, evade or declare charges, but are not exempt from charging without orders.

Improvements to selected army lists included in rulebook.
2.
1.The following armies (but not ally contingents derived from them) can have up to 1/3 of their battle groups of the specified type upgraded to Superior, representing separately deployed picked warriors. Such battle groups cannot exceed 8 bases.
Early Nomad (Foot warriors)
Early Highland Raiders (Warriors)
Early Libyan (Swordsmen)
Illyrian (Warriors)
Ancient Spanish (Scutarii or heavy caetrati)
Early German (Warriors)
Early Scots-Irish (Warriors)
Caledonian (Warriors)
Early Visigothic or Early Vandal (Warriors)
Early Frankish, Alamanni, Burgundi, Limigantes, Quadi, Rugii, Suebi or Turcilingi (Warriors)
3.The minimum size of battle groups including auxiliary foot with Light Spear capability in Dominate and Foederate Roman lists is increased to 6.
4.Imitation legionaries in Pontic and Galatian (but not Numidian) armies gain the option to be Armoured.
5.All Byzantine Cavalry battle groups classified as ½ Lancers, Swordsmen, ½ Bow, Swordsmen, gain the option to have all bases classified as Bow*, Lancers, Swordsmen.
6.All Byzantine Cavalry battle groups with all bases classified as Bow, Swordsmen gain the option to have all bases classified as Light Horse (same armour class etc.).
7.Christian Nubian armies cannot have more than ½ of their Medium Foot archers battle groups as Superior.
8.All Drilled Average Knights specified as “mercenary” gain the option to be Undrilled Superior.
9.Later Ottoman Turkish armies cannot have more than ½ of their Timariots battle groups as Superior.
10.Late Heian to Muromachi Japanese can have up to ½ of their “Bushi and followers” battle groups as Superior.

Recommended army sizes and table sizes changed to encourage more variety in tournament formats.
11.

Hopefully, many of these changes can be built into FOG PC 2.0.

Deeter

"Close combat effects of superior armour reduced:
A single level of armour advantage does not give a + POA if this would result in an overall ++ POA.
This means that Barbarian foot are no longer a walkover for Romans."

Hmm this one concerns me as it seems designed SOLEY to help protected impact barabarians vs armoured Romans, a fraction of all the armies in all the lists...

Wont this adversely effect the great balance between Roman vs Hellenistic Pike armies ( imho the best balanced matchups of em all)

TheGrayMouser wrote:"Close combat effects of superior armour reduced:
A single level of armour advantage does not give a + POA if this would result in an overall ++ POA.
This means that Barbarian foot are no longer a walkover for Romans."

Hmm this one concerns me as it seems designed SOLEY to help protected impact barabarians vs armoured Romans, a fraction of all the armies in all the lists...

Wont this adversely effect the great balance between Roman vs Hellenistic Pike armies ( imho the best balanced matchups of em all)

I think the same.

Shouldn't affect them much, since legionaries are usually even or -1 POA vs pikes, only reaching +1 POA without armour when the pikes are already fragmented.
Other unit to improve as a result of this change: Unarmoured archers will be -1 POA in melee not -2 POA. Makes those Nubian archers even tougher - good job they are reduced to only 50% superior.
Changes seem good...roll on FOG PC 2.0!

Armored Legionaries vs Unprotected Archers wouldnt be 2 levels of armor? So they will be +2 POA?

This armor change only counts if the Legionaries are +2 POA right? So against Protected Pikes they would still have the armor POA?

Tjs

Thanks Pip.

So the million dollar question is...When does the new PC version come out. Do I buy now or wait. I would be cheesed off if i bought now and the new edition came out next week.

Im getting pretty keen though, the more I dip in to this forum.

Thanks

John

JohnyCat wrote:Thanks Pip.

So the million dollar question is...When does the new PC version come out. Do I buy now or wait. I would be cheesed off if i bought now and the new edition came out next week.

Im getting pretty keen though, the more I dip in to this forum.

Thanks

John

No one knows when the new PC version will be ready, players are guessing anything from October - March! I wouuld definately advise you buying the 1.8 game now because the new game will be a FREE upgrade.

The schedual as I see it:-

1) Current game pcFOG1.8(RB) (written in RealBasic) available now.
2) Free upgrade to pcFOG1.8(U) (written in Unity) available somewhen between Oct-Mar
3) pcFOG2.0(U) availiable shortly after that.

Just to confuse things, ttFOG 1.8 (tabletop miniatures) is being converted to ttFOG 2.0 digital (tabletop miniatures with ipad digital rulebook) in the next few months - no eta yet!

I hope this helps

Thanks Ian, that is exactly what I wanted to know.

I think I am gonna dive in this weekend.

Well had some idea of some of the changes beforehand through word of mouth but these do look MAJOR.

Some of the changes reminds me of changes that took place in DBM. Not exact changes but the reason. The reason being players had found great ways to use X and then all of a sudden it is changed in the next update.

Never forgive WRG when I had bought a Later Ach Persian army. Within a few months , new army lists and most of my newly painted troops would have to be rebased.

I am still quite new at the tt game but hopefully these changes may well increase the number of players playing.

Wonder how long it will take for the Ruddock's, Evans', Hanleys and Stewarts of teh game to spot the now good armies?

The change in armour aagain would affect armoured hoplites vs protected swordsmen (lt sp/imp foot, bow?) in combat.

At present they would be ++, better armour and off spr, no use of sword

So unprot troops are better off?

It seems...at least unless they get disrupted. There I do not know if the armour would count or they would be at even POA's.....Not sure about this new rule. The armies will go to fight naked. Why woud you spent points on armor? Only to be more protected against missile fire?

And this one?

"Heavy weapon capability no longer cancelled by skilled swordsmen or skirmishers".

There you would love your Dacians Eric . The poor Romans are going to pray to their Gods.

Cheers!

ericdoman1 wrote:The change in armour aagain would affect armoured hoplites vs protected swordsmen (lt sp/imp foot, bow?) in combat.

At present they would be ++, better armour and off spr, no use of sword

So unprot troops are better off?

No, they wouldnt be better off , the rule appears only to apply if you have only 1 level of better armour ie armoured vs protected, unprotected vs armoured would be 2 levels...

What I dont like about this rule is it makes harming your opponent by causing disruptions(the PRIMARY GOAl) a moot point to some degree...

In your example with the new rule, an arm. spear vs a swordsman would be be +1 POA ( counts the spear, cant count the armour, no sword as vs steady spear) However , if the spear is disrupted, the spear is tadah! STILL +1 POA! (+ spear POA vs the + sword nets, but then ok , now the armour counts ...)

Yep the dacians and teh Galloglaigh. Now the legions will have problems vs HA, HW sup guys.

Although the Roamns historically feared teh Falxmen and I think they had troops who would havemore armour than normal to combat it.

However, I believe, if there are 2 differences in armour, that is HA to prot or arm to unprot. I believe you will receive a + for that

I am guessing that all figure manaufacturers must enjoy new additions, clarifications to the rules?

Hi Tgm

Was about to submit this when you jumped/hopped in.

It probably menas that some combats are going to last a bit longer?