Slitherine

I want to paint some battle wagons. Are them really useless? As some people say. What Army for the late medieval period? (I also will like to use them with FOGR)

They are not the best troop type but are quite good at holding up mounted - so good on a defensive wing. Hussites are the archetype; but Hungarians have them too I think.

Thanks. Hungarians seem a good possibility. Time now to move to the east!

The Germans get some too.

There's one army list I'm trying to remember - German city-states? That is a combo of knights, spearmen, archers, and battlewagons. a valid tactic is to deploy far in a corner of the board, with the knights up front, the board edge holding one flank, and the wagons holding the other, then the entire army just trundles forward.

I've also been looking for a Medieval army with Wagons. Ideally not as a primary aspect of the army (a la Hussites) but as an interesting supplement. I thought I heard of one army list that has both wagons and longbowmen - does that exist? Or just a figment of my feverish imagination?

I think the 'holding up a flank with battle wagons' wouldn't work unless your opponent decided to let it work.

You put them down last and he's going to be able to swing his mounted across the back of his battle line quicker than you can re-deploy your battle wagons and if he does that he's going to 'points deny' a large chunk of your army.

ravenflight wrote:I think the 'holding up a flank with battle wagons' wouldn't work unless your opponent decided to let it work.

You put them down last and he's going to be able to swing his mounted across the back of his battle line quicker than you can re-deploy your battle wagons and if he does that he's going to 'points deny' a large chunk of your army.

BWg can stay where they are, they don't redeploy. They should not be a large chunk of the army and while the enemy redeploys you can attack.

But they are still pooh!

They wouldn't have to be, but the FAQ sure didn't help them. Only added confusion to an already confusing troop type.

ravenflight wrote:I think the 'holding up a flank with battle wagons' wouldn't work unless your opponent decided to let it work.

You put them down last and he's going to be able to swing his mounted across the back of his battle line quicker than you can re-deploy your battle wagons and if he does that he's going to 'points deny' a large chunk of your army.

I recently used them ( 2 units of 2) in the later german medieval army against an English 100 years war army so there were few cavalry/knights to block .Losing the initiative did not help . I certainly would not contemplate using them where I did not know what army I was up against! I did indeed use them to block a flank.( The models also double up as my medieval camp when put on an empty base of the right size.( One really does seem to need rather too many camps if you want a historical visual effect for different eras and in 25/28mm and that is quite an investment in time money and shelf space. )

They are tricky and of doubtful value I agree but my opponent had not anticipated them or seen them before so was unsure how to react! I moved them forward to their planned forward deployment position as a battle line of two units ( tho' someone may tell me they cannot do that - if so oops!) with my inspired general leading them but deployment was awkward as each unit needed to wheel up to 90 degrees in the opposite direction to form a hollow shallow V shape or do a 90 degree turn . They have crossbows and hvy weapon but are a firing platform only to the side. I seem to recall I won but they played no part neither firing nor fighting!

In a large army of over 1000 points they might be helpful if you have used up the max of many of the other types available and cannot get to the total you want. My regular opponent and I do like " big" battles and that can be an issue for some armies where the we don't have enough of the " bog standard types" to hit the max . But I doubt I will use them often. On the other hand with a wider table for larger army maybe they could useful as a kind of mobile terrain block!

The recent movie Barbarrossa ( set in Northern Italy in Lombardy) has an interesting take on them

MikeHorah wrote: I seem to recall I won but they played no part neither firing nor fighting!

Sometimes units add value to your army without actually engaging in combat - the psychological or logistical effect of having them in the way is enough to impact your opponent's behavior. If his cav lost a few turns maneuvering around the line of battlewagons, that could be a very valuable benefit.

Zephyr40k wrote:

MikeHorah wrote: I seem to recall I won but they played no part neither firing nor fighting!

Sometimes units add value to your army without actually engaging in combat - the psychological or logistical effect of having them in the way is enough to impact your opponent's behavior. If his cav lost a few turns maneuvering around the line of battlewagons, that could be a very valuable benefit.

Good point!