Slitherine

Tried designing an 800 pt Russian 1812 list, and was wondering is this the correct way of doing the army list ?

C-in-C Skilled

1st Division - Competent Sub-Gen
3x4 Musketeers Line Average Drilled
1x4 Musketeers Line Average Conscript
1x2 6lb Artillery Medium Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

2nd Division - Competent Sub-Gen
2x4 Grenadiers Line Superior Drilled
1x4 Jaegers Line Average Drilled
1x Artillery added
1x Cavalry added

Cavalry Division - Competent Sub-Gen
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Veteran Shock
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Drilled Shock
1x Dragoons Heavy Cavalry Average Drilled
1x Hussar Light Cavalry Average Drilled
1x 6lb Horse Art Horse Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

Thanks

Hi i've just post the same problem...thank you!!
Francesco

Scrumpy wrote:Tried designing an 800 pt Russian 1812 list, and was wondering is this the correct way of doing the army list ?

C-in-C Skilled

1st Division - Competent Sub-Gen
3x4 Musketeers Line Average Drilled
1x4 Musketeers Line Average Conscript
1x2 6lb Artillery Medium Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

2nd Division - Competent Sub-Gen
2x4 Grenadiers Line Superior Drilled
1x4 Jaegers Line Average Drilled
1x Artillery added
1x Cavalry added

Cavalry Division - Competent Sub-Gen
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Veteran Shock
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Drilled Shock
1x Dragoons Heavy Cavalry Average Drilled
1x Hussar Light Cavalry Average Drilled
1x 6lb Horse Art Horse Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

Thanks

This is my french 1812 800 pt.(796)

Cc skilled

1st division competent general

1x4 line infantry avarege veteran
1x6 line infantry avarege drilled
1x6 light infantry avarege drilled
1x2 12 pdr heavy art. Veteran

2nd division competent general

1x6 line infantry average concr.
1x6 line infantry avarege concr.
1x4 light infantry avarege drilled
2x2 8pdr medium art.avarege drilled
1 officer attachm.

cavalry division general competent

1x4 hussars superior drilled
1x4 chasseurs superior drilled
1x4 cuirassier avarege drilled shock


Thanks

Scrumpy wrote:Tried designing an 800 pt Russian 1812 list, and was wondering is this the correct way of doing the army list ?

C-in-C Skilled

1st Division - Competent Sub-Gen
3x4 Musketeers Line Average Drilled
1x4 Musketeers Line Average Conscript
1x2 6lb Artillery Medium Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

2nd Division - Competent Sub-Gen
2x4 Grenadiers Line Superior Drilled
1x4 Jaegers Line Average Drilled
1x Artillery added
1x Cavalry added

Cavalry Division - Competent Sub-Gen
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Veteran Shock
1x Cuirassier Heavy Cav Average Drilled Shock
1x Dragoons Heavy Cavalry Average Drilled
1x Hussar Light Cavalry Average Drilled
1x 6lb Horse Art Horse Art. Average Drilled
1x Artillery added

Thanks

Of course that is not what the Russian historically used.
A russian infantry division "could " have a battalion of grenadiers. But if it had any regiments of Grenadiers it would be 100% unless the guard. The line divisions were always 1/3 yeger and 2/3 line.
The Cavalry divisions that had them were 100% cuirassier except for guard. And there should probalby be 2-1 ratio of dragoons to Hussars/Uhlans.

Now in 1806-7 they had more mixed units but worse command and control.

Do you want historical, or the army lists provided ?

Seriously though, I think we need a teaching game at Chantilly to see how the rules play etc.

.... depend if you want play with point sistem ( tournament style) or historical!!
in the first case will be difficult to create historical army list!

francesco

Here we see the difficulty in using an "Army List" without reference to historical ORBATS. There have been a few ongoing discussions on TMP about the use of army lists vs points vs historical ORBATS. It might be interesting to see some "armies" put together from the lists with mixed Heavy and Light cavalry Divisions etc. In addition surely 3 Divs make up a Corps not an army!!

I prefer to play historical scenarios and Campaign based games, however for club night will happily used the army lists as we currently do for other FOGs. I do foresee some future discussion on the subject!

Guys,

You may want to upgrade as many generals as possible to skilled.

It is also worth having your C-in-C as charismatic if allowed, gives you an extra dice when rallying.

Don

Scrumpy wrote:Do you want historical, or the army lists provided ?

Seriously though, I think we need a teaching game at Chantilly to see how the rules play etc.

Definately want practice.

I think the napoleonic player base will not react well to shreding too much history. Having historical-ish battles is great. But we know far too much about the army composition vis-a-vis Neo-assyrians to have compeltely non-historical armies.

hazelbark wrote:

Scrumpy wrote:Do you want historical, or the army lists provided ?

Seriously though, I think we need a teaching game at Chantilly to see how the rules play etc.

Definately want practice.

I think the napoleonic player base will not react well to shreding too much history. Having historical-ish battles is great. But we know far too much about the army composition vis-a-vis Neo-assyrians to have compeltely non-historical armies.

Heres the rub is FOG N a historical simulation or is it a game, discuss.

Dave

BTW I'm reading the rules as much as I can and working out a Westpalian list from historical documents since no list till june.(will be hoping that they do get two Cuirasier Regiments in the list).

Just wanted to say that I've been waiting a decent set of Napoleonic rules for a while so heres hoping.

david53 wrote: Just wanted to say that I've been waiting a decent set of Napoleonic rules for a while so heres hoping.

Me too, Dave.

Just got my set of rules today. Amazon was an over achiever! The said it would be mailed out today for delivery in 2 days, but the sent it out yesterday and I got it today. Skimmed through and I think I might be very happy (e.g., the "attachment" rule looks cool).

hazelbark wrote: Of course that is not what the Russian historically used.

My gaming buddies and I have taken up FOG-N and quickly came to the conclusion that this will be the case for all army lists!

Its my belief (and others I know) that if you engage in Napoleonic wargaming then you should have more than a passing knowledge of the troops involved - sadly, I see more and more people on forums who do not, and it shows in their army lists.

Thankfully, the guys I do Napoleonic wargaming with have a very good idea on what is/isnt in a Napoleonic Corps for the nations involved, and we'll play FOG-N accordingly.


Jimi

But if the only Games you can get are tournement games you have to play with the lists as they are.

With the period there is a large percentage of historical army lists available.

But rules writers have to try and make the games fair by bringing in points, or I remember 20 odd years ago wanting to play spainish armies using WRG but finding a large number of people wanted to be brits if not then french cause they could beat everyone apart from the Brits. At least with FOG there seems a chance of using a smaller army with a fair chance of winning a game.
Dave

Yes, you can only play tournaments with what lists give you.

Here's hoping that the lists in the two books are as historical as can be without stepping into the realms of fantasy.


Jimi

Perhaps it has something to do with the scope of the lists. Your Corps at scale is used to represent an army, so you get the mix of troops an army could have but the size of a Corps.

philqw78 wrote:Perhaps it has something to do with the scope of the lists. Your Corps at scale is used to represent an army, so you get the mix of troops an army could have but the size of a Corps.

There are plenty of corps sized actions with a real corps in History. Davout at Auerstadt for example. He did not have a special min-max fantasy Bosphoran contingent. He had the Corps he went to war with.

The Bavarian phase of the 1809 campaign is another. Quatra Bras and so forth.

If the rules work like it looks like, then it will make the 1805-07 historical battles real interesting. For instance the Russians had "divisions" which were combined arms outfits that did have some of these and some of those. But a really bulk command structure that is probably really limited in Command points in game terms. The French Corps would be very structured and mono-troop type driven, but have a far superior command point capablity. Then you can have real napoleonics.

This is my french 1812 800 pt.(796)

Cc skilled

1st division competent general

1x4 line infantry avarege veteran
1x6 line infantry avarege drilled
1x6 light infantry avarege drilled
1x2 12 pdr heavy art. Veteran

2nd division competent general

1x6 line infantry average concr.
1x6 line infantry avarege concr.
1x4 light infantry avarege drilled
2x2 8pdr medium art.avarege drilled
1 officer attachm.

cavalry division general competent

1x4 hussars superior drilled
1x4 chasseurs superior drilled
1x4 cuirassier avarege drilled shock

The 2nd division cannot have two artillery units. Max of 1 per division (page 17).

AlanCutner wrote:

This is my french 1812 800 pt.(796)

Cc skilled

1st division competent general

1x4 line infantry avarege veteran
1x6 line infantry avarege drilled
1x6 light infantry avarege drilled
1x2 12 pdr heavy art. Veteran

2nd division competent general

1x6 line infantry average concr.
1x6 line infantry avarege concr.
1x4 light infantry avarege drilled
2x2 8pdr medium art.avarege drilled
1 officer attachm.

cavalry division general competent

1x4 hussars superior drilled
1x4 chasseurs superior drilled
1x4 cuirassier avarege drilled shock

The 2nd division cannot have two artillery units. Max of 1 per division (page 17).

thank you Alan!!

francesco

Just a small thought on page 40 it states Brigade Groups must not exceed the Divisional Commanders command level by more than one ie a competent commander may control a BG of 2 units not as they are below or do i have this wrong?
1st division competent general

1x4 line infantry avarege veteran
1x6 line infantry avarege drilled
1x6 light infantry avarege drilled
1x2 12 pdr heavy art. Veteran

2nd division competent general

1x6 line infantry average concr.
1x6 line infantry avarege concr.
1x4 light infantry avarege drilled
2x2 8pdr medium art.avarege drilled
1 officer attachm.

Division size and BG size are not the same thing. A division is an organisational unit of at least 3 units. A BG is a temporary grouping to enable combined movement.