Slitherine

I have one of these and they ALWAYS do less damage than a Stuka does. I know you can use it to neutralize cities and prevent the AI from building more units in a hex but... I mean come on that isn't that useful?

What are the best ways to use these? They rarely kill things in cities.

DorianIBD wrote:I have one of these and they ALWAYS do less damage than a Stuka does. I know you can use it to neutralize cities and prevent the AI from building more units in a hex but... I mean come on that isn't that useful?

What are the best ways to use these? They rarely kill things in cities.

The two best uses are to attack fleets and to cause the loss of ammo to unit.

Many scenarios have naval unit and the Strats are the best unit to take them out with. They rarely take any damage but they do a ton if they are experiance. I've knocked out full strength BB's in one shot with 3 star bombers before.

When you get to Russia and those big behemoth tanks are coming at you, you will appreciate the Strats. Most of the big Russian tanks only have 4 ammo and a Strat can take it to 1 or 0 in a single attack. They can't hurt you if they can't shoot!

One of the best things about Strategic Bombers is the ammo depletion as Marty ably pointed out in the last post.

The other is the suppression value. They can do alot of suppression when they get more experienced and the only thing on the ground that can damage them back is AA . Don't forget that suppressed units can't shoot either at your attacking ground troops.

Never forget that while they are doing the suppresion they also take down the entrechment level a notch (which is also a great force multiplier),,and like I stated above the only thing one the ground that can shoot back is AA.

I always have at least three to four in my core

Taking out enemy ships would be a good enough reason by itself, but remember that even tough Strats may not kill much in a city, it is generating suppression and lowering entrenchment.

Plus an experianced 'Strat bomber will last a lot longer over cities protected by AAA than a Tac will. Many times I send in a Strat to soften up a large city for two or three rounds then when I am ready for the land based assault I will let fly with the Strat one last time, move it out and enter the Tac Bomber and then ground assault. Works well for me.

MartyWard wrote:Most of the big Russian tanks only have 4 ammo and a Strat can take it to 1 or 0 in a single attack. They can't hurt you if they can't shoot!

Strat bombing never reduce ammo below 1. But indeed, with two experienced strategic bombers attacking consecutively you can reduce many dangerous opponents from full ammo to 1 ammo.

Level bombers are very useful in scenarios involving enemy ships and invaluable in Barbarossa (hint: Brest fortress )

They also gain experience much faster than other units, and once they gain 2-3 stars they really shine.

And to add one more thing Strategic Bombers can also 'neutralize' a city/airfield/port, so the flag goes white and the enemy can no longer place/build units there anymore.

Think not Strategic Bombers as unit to inflict losses to the enemy (except for naval units) but to prevent losses to your unit by reducing entrenchment, ammo and add surpression.

Rood wrote:And to add one more thing Strategic Bombers can also 'neutralize' a city/airfield/port, so the flag goes white and the enemy can no longer place/build units there anymore.

Think not Strategic Bombers as unit to inflict losses to the enemy (except for naval units) but to prevent losses to your unit by reducing entrenchment, ammo and add surpression.

Great way of putting it Rood

Still I find it somewhat strange that strats are great naval bombers as well, at least so many of them. It makes sense for some, but IMO not all. Otoh divebombers like Stukas (not to mention specifc US, Japanese naval types or topedo bombers) did quite well in sinking ships too.

The suppression caused by strategic bombers, ideally combined with artillery is often much more useful than the higher damage done by a Stuka.

Destroying ammo and fuel is also very useful to cripple enemy units. Besides their use as naval attackers.

An experienced strat bomber is super effective vs enemy ammo supply. If Im counting right a 5* overstrength to 15 unit of strat bombers will have 105% efficiency, meaning it will leave any unit with only 1 ammo each time it attacks (in good weather).

dragos wrote:

MartyWard wrote:Most of the big Russian tanks only have 4 ammo and a Strat can take it to 1 or 0 in a single attack. They can't hurt you if they can't shoot!

Strat bombing never reduce ammo below 1. But indeed, with two experienced strategic bombers attacking consecutively you can reduce many dangerous opponents from full ammo to 1 ammo.

Level bombers are very useful in scenarios involving enemy ships and invaluable in Barbarossa (hint: Brest fortress )

They also gain experience much faster than other units, and once they gain 2-3 stars they really shine.

You can get ammo to zero with Strats, just not usually in one shot unless the ammo is already low.

bebro wrote:Still I find it somewhat strange that strats are great naval bombers as well, at least so many of them. It makes sense for some, but IMO not all. Otoh divebombers like Stukas (not to mention specifc US, Japanese naval types or topedo bombers) did quite well in sinking ships too.

Agreed. Historically, strategic bombers had a dismal track record against ships. Granted it's more of a game than a simualtion, but it's pretty ironic that people spend so much time debating the historical justification for the values attributed to a particular unit while ignoring this glaring flaw.

Agreed. Historically, strategic bombers had a dismal track record against ships. Granted it's more of a game than a simualtion, but it's pretty ironic that people spend so much time debating the historical justification for the values attributed to a particular unit while ignoring this glaring flaw.

I actually don't have any information regarding how effective they were against naval targets or if they were used very often so can't comment. I do know that level bombers sunk the German battleship Tirpitz in harbour.

Yup, the Tirpitz was sunk by a large bomb, but only after a fairly large number of sorties IIRC.

Find a map design where prestige is a shortage.

Then you will see Strategic Bombers rule.

@Dragos: Well said!

MartyWard wrote:You can get ammo to zero with Strats, just not usually in one shot unless the ammo is already low.

In my experience, I have never reduced an unit to 0 ammo. My impression is that bomber experience determines the percent of the ammo that will be deducted, after which the deduction is rounded up. So unless the bomber has 100% efficiency it will not remove that last 1 point of ammo. I may be wrong about the rounding up thing, an inside developer might clear things up. Playing on FM level or extra, I have not enough experience to have 100% efficiency for testing.

dragos wrote:

MartyWard wrote:You can get ammo to zero with Strats, just not usually in one shot unless the ammo is already low.

In my experience, I have never reduced an unit to 0 ammo. My impression is that bomber experience determines the percent of the ammo that will be deducted, after which the deduction is rounded up. So unless the bomber has 100% efficiency it will not remove that last 1 point of ammo. I may be wrong about the rounding up thing, an inside developer might clear things up. Playing on FM level or extra, I have not enough experience to have 100% efficiency for testing.

I've had it happen when I Strat bombed a unit twice in a turn. I think the key is that the unit can't have full ammo. The first attack takes it to low ammo and the second bombing takes out the last shot.

MartyWard wrote:

dragos wrote:

MartyWard wrote:You can get ammo to zero with Strats, just not usually in one shot unless the ammo is already low.

In my experience, I have never reduced an unit to 0 ammo. My impression is that bomber experience determines the percent of the ammo that will be deducted, after which the deduction is rounded up. So unless the bomber has 100% efficiency it will not remove that last 1 point of ammo. I may be wrong about the rounding up thing, an inside developer might clear things up. Playing on FM level or extra, I have not enough experience to have 100% efficiency for testing.

I've had it happen when I Strat bombed a unit twice in a turn. I think the key is that the unit can't have full ammo. The first attack takes it to low ammo and the second bombing takes out the last shot.

MartyWard is correct if you have a bomber start over a unit and bomb with that one then bomb with a second bomber you can knock them down to zero ammo. I am pretty sure you can knock them down to zero if they are already under their max ammo too.