Slitherine

This might be more appropriate in the mod subforum, and I may make a post there soon, but I wanted to get input from the general audience on balancing content for Single Player, especially with regards to the DLCs.

Thus far, I think most players agree that DLC 1940 was the most challenging in terms of unit balance. Those French/British tanks are quite a bit superior to the German panzers, and require advanced tactics to defeat. In comparison, the T-34 tanks for DLC 41 are not that great against the panzers, and the KV tanks are tough, but not too threatening either. Similarly, I feel German air power is a little too effective, to the point where the AI fighters are more of a nuisance to be cleared out in 1-2 turns than any serious threat.

What I would like is for players to suggest changes to the SP content, both in terms of German units and Allied units, so that unit stats are better balanced and perhaps reflect historical values even better.

For instance, I adjusted the Sturmpanzer I to be range 2, I increased its cost, and I changed the availability date significantly.
Experience growth halved for 0-2 stars while unchanged for 2-5 stars. The net effect should be that EXP gain as compared with Field Marshall difficulty is that it is the same for 0-2 stars and doubled for 2-5 stars.

Please review the changes below for v1.0. It does not include air units, which I feel are especially hard to balance, or unit stats for 1941. I would like people's input as much as possible.

Changes to units were only for those relevant to DLC 39 and 40. Only the campaign.pzdat is adjusted for DLC 39, but not for DLC 40.

All SE units now cost only 50% of their Wehrmacht counterparts. All SE transports cost half compared to those for standard infantry. These changes are meant to reflect that SE units are routinely provided with the best equipment. You are not meant to save and reload to obtain your SE units.

All SE infantry have +1 AMMO, +1 SA, and +1 INI compared to their Wehrmacht counterparts. All SE panzers have +2 AMMO, +20% fuel (to represent their higher priority in terms of resupply), +1 INI, and +1 HA compared to their Wehrmacht counterparts.

The vast majority of infantry in the Wehrmacht during WWII marched on foot and did not receive the use of trucks. Since it is assumed you command a panzer corps, to which motorized infantry divisions were assigned, the cost for transports is higher but not impossible to afford. ART, AT, and AA costs have been adjusted to reflect this. SE infantry, with their improved stats and cheaper motorized transports, should hopefully be much more desired.

Ammo count was changed for certain units in part to represent mechanical stability and in part for balance reasons, as opposed to historical values.

AttackExpBonusRel changed to 25. DefenseExpBonusRel changed to 25. This has the effect of making experience for early war units much more easily felt, without hopefully being overpowering.

Unit Changes:

Wehrmacht Infantry: Cost reduced to 107.

Kavallerie: Cost to 205, nopurchase flag added, INI to 2, GD to 5.

Fallschirmjäger: Cost to 305, GD to 6, AMMO to 5.

Gebirgsjäger: Cost to 254, INI to 3 to simulate their superior training, CD to 3 to simulate their training for fighting in close terrain.

Brückenpionere: Cost to 226.

Panzer IA: Cost to 124, GD to 5, AD to 6, CD to 1.

Panzer IB: Cost to 134, GD to 5, AD to 6, CD to 1.

Panzer IIC: Cost reduced to 163, AMMO to 9.

P38(t)A: AMMO to 11 (to represent superior mechanical reliability), GD to 7.

Panzer IIIE: AMMO to 9.

Panzer IIIF: AMMO to 9.

Panzer IVD: Cost to 320, AMMO to 8.

Panzerjäger IB: AMMO to 7, SA to 2.

SdKfz 222: Cost to 171, AMMO to 4 (mostly for balance reasons, so there is a reason to buy the PzIIC), GD to 5, AD to 6.

SdKfz 231 6rad: Cost to 195, AMMO to 6 (again, mostly for balance reasons).

SdKfz 232 8rad: Cost to 217, AMMO to 4 (balance reasons).

3.7 cm PaK 36: Cost to 56.

7.5 cm FK 16 nA: Cost to 90.

10.5 cm leFH 18: Cost to 156.

15 cm sFH 18: Cost to 243, ROF to 9.

Sturmpanzer I: Cost to 362, range to 2, availability date to 1.5.1940, end date to 1.7.1940.
The Sturmpanzer I is something that can be purchased for your operations in France, until the StuG IIIB comes along for DLC 41. Historically the Sturmpanzer I was made in very small numbers, thus the limited availability.

2 cm Flakvierling 38: Cost to 94.

2 cm FlaK 38: Cost to 51.

3.7 cm FlaK 37: Cost to 87.

8.8 cm FlaK 36: Cost to 224.

SdKfz 10/4: Cost to 204.

SdKfz 7/1: Cost to 226.

Opel Blitz: Cost to 100.

SdKfz 251/1: Cost to 200, SA to 3, GD to 5.

Ju 87B: AMMO to 4, SA to 8, HA to 5, AA to 5.

Ju 87R: Cost to 254, fuel to 64, AMMO to 3, HA to 5, AA to 5.

Bf 110C: Cost to 356, AA to 12.

Bf 110D: Cost to 374, AA to 12

Polish cavalry: SA to 4, HA to 2, GD to 5.

Polish Mnt: SA to 3, HA to 2.

Cavalry in WWII was mostly used as mounted infantry. One of the biggest myths of the Polish campaign is that Polish cavalry wielding lances charged German panzers. In fact their cavalry was considered the elite of the Polish army and were given the superb Wz. 35 AT rifle, which was effective in close range against all contemporary German tanks. The Polish Mnt have also been given +1 HA to represent being equipped with the Wz. 35 AT rifle.

Somua S35: HA to 7 (French tanks really were this good, with their 47mm SA AT gun), AMMO to 5 (French tanks were notoriously difficult to resupply and prone to mechanical problems), fuel to 30, INI to 3 (penalty reflects the 1-man turrets of the French tanks, which were highly inefficient), CD to 2.

Char B1: HA to 7, Speed to 3 (infantry tank), fuel to 12, INI to 3 (penalty reflects the 1-man turrets of the French tanks, which were highly inefficient).

The Char B1 was an unstoppable monstrosity… until it ran out of fuel, which was often, or until it met a 88 gun.

Panhard 178: AMMO to 6, GD to 7.

Matilda II: Fuel to 30, INI to 5.

Hotchkiss H39: HA to 5.

French Infantry: GD to 6.

French Engineers: INI to 1.

French Light Cavalry: GD to 4.

47 mm SA AT gun: HA to 7.

QF 2 Pounder: Spotting to 1.

T-26S: Speed to 5, GD to 6.

Soviet Cavalry: GD to 6.

I'm not sure what the effects will be in game play but I applaud the attention to historical detail. What I see above makes sense to me, at least.

Hi, deducter. The changes are made in the "equipment.pzeqp" file? If so, do you mind uploading this file to save time for users who are interested in making these changes? Thanks in advance.

This version is actually available in the mod section in a thread called "Making Rommel difficulty harder." You can download it there. But I'm not quite done with my changes, there's still quite a few units to change, including all the air units and most of the Russian units for DLC 41. Thus, I want some input first before I make more changes and before I upload a new version.

I think this is the third thread for a stat-changing mod where it lists stuff only like "defense to 12".
For these informations to be useful at a glance, you really HAVE to write defense: 10->12 or something...
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rezaf

I'm against making infantry and artillery cheaper along with making SS units cheap and plentiful.

SS units don't need an extra bonus than what they have now

Right now the KV's are a little too weak along with the 152mm AT unit.

I think this is the third thread for a stat-changing mod where it lists stuff only like "defense to 12".
For these informations to be useful at a glance, you really HAVE to write defense: 10->12 or something...

I kinda agree, but I sort of remember a lot of the values now. Plus you just have to offer the suggestion, e.g. "I think the Hurricane needs more AD," or "The T-34/40 seems to die too easily," or what Razz said, "Right now the KV's are a little too weak along with the 152mm AT unit."

If you want to suggestion exact values, even better! But in that case just mention what you think the values should be.

I'm against making infantry and artillery cheaper along with making SS units cheap and plentiful.

The only infantry which is cheaper is the basic Wehrmacht infantry, which is cheaper by 20 prestige. The other infantry either cost the same or massively more expensive.

I'm a bit conflict about artillery, you'll notice that since Opel Blitz now cost 100, I've lowered the price for the 7.5 cm FK 16nA by 50 and the price of the 10.5 cm leFH 18 by 36, which has the net effect of raising the cost of it slightly. Same with the 15 cm artillery. I don't want to touch the price of the 7.5 cm FK 16 nA, since no one would use it unless it was very cheap. Do you think artillery should be even more expensive?

SE units are tricky. I know SE units are still valuable as an extra deployment slot, but I would like them to be truly elite units. Making them cost less will also allow the player to better afford elite reinforcements for them. On the other hand,I don't want people to be saving/reloading to get.

I've been thinking about increasing the price for the panzers/fighters/stukas/artillery even more, but I hesitate to do so because originally I developed this to go along with a -75% difficulty. However, my intention is now that this should hopefully be playable on all difficulties, and from what I've noticed, prestige is not a problem with DLC 41. Perhaps by increasing costs, the net effect will be to reduce prestige quite a bit. But how should I proceed?

deducter wrote:I kinda agree, but I sort of remember a lot of the values now.

Lol, well the point of my criticism was, most people are going to have a hard time judging the quality of your change if they have to do their own research to find out whether you increased or decreased the vanilla value, and by what amount.
It's irrelevant that YOU remember the values, people reading your thread possibly do not.
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rezaf

One thing I would like to see is a vast decrease to the air defense value of many units especially in the early war. Early war infantry for example has AD 16 which is way too much and makes tactical bombers rather inefficient. In the original PG AD value of the same units was around 8 IIRC.

Thanks for the clarification, deducter, I'll check out the thread.

deducter wrote:SE units are tricky. I know SE units are still valuable as an extra deployment slot, but I would like them to be truly elite units. Making them cost less will also allow the player to better afford elite reinforcements for them. On the other hand,I don't want people to be saving/reloading to get.

Those gamers who want SE units will reload saves whether you make it cheaper or not and I'm one of them.

One thing I would like to see is a vast decrease to the air defense value of many units especially in the early war. Early war infantry for example has AD 16 which is way too much and makes tactical bombers rather inefficient. In the original PG AD value of the same units was around 8 IIRC.

I disagree here. TAC are already incredibly good in the DLC, in fact, I nerfed the Stukas quite a bit if you look at my changes. I do not want the TACS to be a wonder unit good against everything, including infantry.

What I do want though is the STR bombers to do more suppressing on soft targets. Thus far, STR bombers are only useful either on water maps, or against fortifications to reduce their ammo. I'm thinking of upping the SA of STR bombers by 3 for all STR bombers, comments?

Also, do people want to adjust the way antinaval combat works? I want to reduce the naval attack of STR bombers but massively increase tha naval attack of TAC bombers, comments?

V1.1

Many many more changes made. In conjunction with the previous changes, I think this covers DLCs 1939 to 1941 pretty thoroughly. But I need input!

Prestige costs for SE infantry/tanks is now 80% of their Wehrmacht counterparts. SE transports are 50% cheaper. This represents their priority for new men/equipment. So if in doubt, the player will probably elite reinforce those units.

Now there is an interesting dynamic here with the captured Russian T-34s/KV tanks. I’ve made them vastly superior to the German panzers, but they are also very “prestigious” to maintain. There’s enough captured equipment in the DLCs that you could potentially outfit half or more of your armor with captured equipment, which seems silly to me. Hence, my idea is to make the captured equipment super-expensive to maintain. You could also disband these units for a nice prestige injection, simulating your decision to give to High Command examples of interesting captured equipment for study, and in exchange you can request 2 panzers for the price of one captured unit. I don’t think the choice will be obvious at all.

Note that the French and British captured equipment aren’t more expensive to maintain. The Char B1s and the Matilda IIs will probably be of limited value considering how slow they move, while there’s only one Somua tank to capture.

Bf-109E: cost to 410 to 451, AMMO 8 to 6, GD to 18.

Bf-109F: INI 11 to 10, AMMO 7 to 4, cost 451 to 496, AD to 20.

Bf-109G: INI 10 to 9, AMMO 6 to 4, cost 478 to 574, AD to 19.

Ju-87B: NA 4 to 8, GD 21 to 19.

Ju-87R: NA 4 to 10, GD 21 to 19.

Ju-87D: AMMO 7 to 5, HA 8 to 7, AA 4 to 8, NA 4 to 8, AD 12 to 14, cost 320 to 352.

Bf-110F: INI 6 to 7, AD 14 to 17, fuel 75 to 95, cost 414 to 455.

Bf-110G: AA 15 to 18, fuel 135 to 95, cost 441 to 485.
The Bf-110G hey had serious firepower and sometimes were equipped with rockets, for use against Allied bombers. I left INI at 5 and AD at 15, so hopefully if this plane engages fighters it will take losses. It is also better for ground attack.

Do-17Z: Fuel 35 to 50, SA 4 to 7, HA 1 to 4, NA 5 to 4, AD 14 to 16.

The Do-17Z was useless before, now it can be a cheap, moderately effective bomber.

Ju-88A: SA 10 to 12, HA 4 to 6, NA 10 to 6, cost 372 to 392, AD 16 to 18.

He-111H2: SA 8 to 10, HA 4 to 5, NA 8 to 4, AD 16 to 18.

The generally increase SA and HA should help the STR bombers suppress more. Right now, outside of attacking fortifications, the STR bombers aren’t very useful at all. With my changes, the STR bombers should be quite different from the Stukas. They can stay up much longer without fueling and valuable for eliminating fuel/ammo, and their increased AD means they probably won’t require an escort, unlike the Stukas.

LeO 451: SA 6 to 9, HA 3 to 5, AD 10 to 16.
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AW Whitley Mk. V: SA 9 to 12, HA 5 to 7, AD 14 to 17.

Petlyakov Pe-8: SA 12 to 14, HA 8 to 10, AD 12 to 16.

These bombers should do a bit more damage, but I doubt they’ll be anything other than a nuisance for most players. AD is also higher so they will take longer to shoot down.

M.S. 406: INI 4 to 6, AD 14 to 16. Supposedly this aircraft was highly maneuverable and sturdy, but it was still outclassed by the Bf-109E.

D.520: AD 16 to 17.

Hurricane Mk.I: INI 5 to 6, AD 14 to 16, GD 19 to 17.

Hurricane Mk IIC: INI 5 to 6, GD 20 to 18, AD 16 to 17.

Should the Hurricane Mk. I, Spitfire Mk. I and Mk. II have 3 SA? Does anyone know whether they were actually used to strafe infantry/other soft targets?

Polikarpov I-16: SA 2 to 1, GD 19 to 18, AD 14 to 15.

MiG-3: SA 2 to 1, INI 10 to 9, GD 18 to 19, AD 14 to 16.

LaGG-3: AD 14 to 16.

Yak-1: INI 8 to 9, GD 18 to 19, AD 14 to 17.

Sd.Kfz. 250/1: SA 1 to 3, GD 3 to 5, cost 200 to 300.

Add family modifiers to Opel Blitz, Sd.Kfz. 251/1, and Sd.Kfz. 250/1 and their SE counterparts. Thus you can now upgrade them in a family.

Panzer IIIG: Ammo 10 to 9.

Panzer IIIH: Ammo 10 to 9.

Panzer IIIJ: Ammo 10 to 9.

Panzer IVD: HA 7 to 6.

Panzer IVE: HA 7 to 6, GD 10 to 8, AD 10 to 8, cost 319 to 349.

Panzer IVF: Name to Panzer IVF/1, INI 5 to 6, GD 11 to 10, AD 11 to 10, cost 349 to 419.

StuG IIIB: GD 10 to 9, cost 221 to 332, ROF 11 to 10.
The wonder weapon of 1941. It was built on an up-armored version of the PzIIIF chassis. I’ve massively increased its cost, but most players will probably still get 2-3 for their cores.

Should I remove the nopurchase flag of the StuG IIIA? I think 30 total was produced and only some of them saw battle in France, although that’s about the same numbers as the Sturmpanzer I. If I were to make the StuG IIIA available, it would have worse stats than the StuG IIIB AND cost in the 400ish prestige range, to represent just how rare they were. Still, in conjunction with the PzIII/PzIV, they absolutely wreck the light French/British tanks and provide such overwhelming cover fire that only the Somua, Chars, and Matildas will be of any threat.

10.5 cm leFH 18: Cost 156 to 176. I made the basic artillery slightly more expensive now.

Sd.Kfz.232 8rad: Cost 145 to 247.

Sd.Kfz. 222: AD 6 to 9.

Sd.Kfz. 231: AD 7 to 10.

Sd.Kfz. 232: AD 7 to 10.

I increased the AD for the recon vehicles because I imagine with their smaller profile they are much less vulnerable to TAC bombers. If anyone knows otherwise, please let me know. This should help them resist the AI’s bombing runs, but they are still very vulnerable to ground attacks.

5 cm PaK 38 Price 164 to 99, INI 5 to 4, HA 13 to 11.

7.5 cm PaK 40 Price 185 to 135, INI 6 to 5, availability 24.2.1942 to 1.10.1941 (not historical I know, but it gives the player a chance to use them for Vyazma and Moscow 41), if they so please. Note this weapon has 3 less HA than the 88, but it is half the price.

8.8 cm FlaK 36: Price 224 to 274 (restored to original, net effect is the 88 gun with transport is more expensive, but it is still a wonder weapon).

T-26S: AMMO 17 to 12, INI 6 to 5.

BT-5: AMMO 11 to 9, INI 5 to 6, HA 5 to 6.

BT-7: AMMO 19 to 11, GD 6 to 7, HA 5 to 6.

T-34/40: AMMO 6 to 5, fuel 37, GD 12 to 14, INI 6 to 5, SA 6, HA 8 to 10.

The earliest version of the T-34/40 should hopefully now be a very serious threat to the PzIII and PzIV. The only reason why you can face them in Barbarossa is because you have battle-hardened tank crews backed by Stukas and artillery, whereas the Soviets just throw their armor haphazardly at you. The INI is lower due to the poor state of Russian training, tactical doctrine, and their lack of radios in the earliest version of the T-34/40. Note that the captured T-34/40 actually has INI 6, because I assume the Germans are quick to incorporate their training when using this equipment.

T-34/40(r): Cost 357 to 714, AMMO 6 to 5, fuel 37, GD 12 to 14, HA 8 to 10.

T-34/41: AMMO 10, fuel 60, GD 13 to 15, INI 7, SA 7, HA 11 to 12.

It has higher ammo/fuel (keep at 10 and 60) than the 1940 version, to represent the troubleshooting of many mechanical problems.

T-34/41(r): Cost 386 to 772, GD 13 to 15, HA 11 to 12.

KV-1A: AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 84 to 30, INI 6 to 4 (I believe the early KV tank was even worse than the T-34 when it came to targeting), HA 8 to 10.

KV-1A(r): Cost 458 to 916, AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 84 to 30, INI 6 to 5, HA 8 to 10.

KV-1B: AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 84 to 30, HA 11 to 12.

KV-1B(r): Cost 485 to 970, AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 84 to 30, HA 11 to 12.

KV-1C: AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 75 to 26, SA 8 to 7, HA 12 to 13.

KV-1C(r): Cost 504 to 1008, AMMO 11 to 6, fuel 75 to 26, SA 8 to 7, HA 12 to 13.

The KV series of tanks don’t need more armor, but their guns have been increased to match those of the T-34. They also have much less fuel and ammunition, so as to give the T-34 a clear advantage (speed, does not need constant care).

T-60: AMMO 35 to 9, Spotting 2 to 3, HA 3 to 4,

T-70: Spotting 2 to 3, HA 5 to 6.

I considered changing these two units to the recon class, but it wouldn’t make a difference to the AI. I did increase their Spotting though. In MP, I think these two should be the Soviet equivalent of the PzII Luchs.

45mm M1937: HA 5 to 6

45mm M1942: Cost 126 to 156, SA 2 to 3, HA 6 to 9

76.2mm M1942: AMMO 7 to 10, Cost 158 to 178, HA 9 to 12.

BM-13 Katyusha: Fuel 45 to 60, Speed 6 to 8, SA 13 to 15.

This is one of the iconic Soviet units that doesn’t get enough use by the AI. Hopefully with better speed and attack, AI will now be able to use this unit more effectively.

Guards: AMMO 6 to 7, HA 2 to 3, GD 7 to 8, AD 16 to 18.

Soviet Mnt: INI 1 to 2, GD 6 to 7, AD 16 to 17.

Greek Mnt: SA 6 to 5, GD 6 to 7.

Greek Cavalry: GD 3 to 6.

Yugoslavian Cavalry: GD 3 to 6.