Slitherine

Generally when one unit charges another in the rear, the defender immediately loses a cohesion step, and then faces impact combat.

This does not always happen, however, and (surprise surprise) I cannot find any description of how this works in the help file. I have pasted what it says below, it seems to refer only to melee combat, not impact.

I have a very hard time understanding how a unit charged in the rear would not suffer significant adverse morale consequences.


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A battle group contacted to their rear at the start of a melee combat by an enemy battle group, usually automatically turns to fight any opponents at the instant of combat.

A battle group other than light foot or light horse, with an adjacent enemy battle group other than light foot or light horse, in their rear arc after turning will suffer a penalty in melee combat.

If there is an adjacent friendly battle group other than light foot or light horse in their rear arc when the battle group has to take a cohesion test it will gain a benefit taking the test.

If there is an adjacent enemy battle group other than light foot or light horse in their rear arc when the battle group has to take a cohesion test it will have a penalty taking the test.

That one actually is in the help-file, although you have to look for it.

A battle group charged in its rear by a battle group, other than light foot or light horse unless also, light foot or light horse, that started its charge move behind a line extending across the rear of the target battle group will suffer an instant cohesion loss on contact and before any impact combat takes place and may rout automatically on contact.

A battle group charged in its rear by a battle group, other than light foot or light horse unless also, light foot or light horse, will always suffer the maximum combat penalty difference during the impact combat.

See under Front, Flanks & Rear in the help-file. There's a diagram explaining what they mean by "....a line extending across the rear...."
It's logical when you see it. Basically it's only a rear-attack if the charging unit started behind the target.

Lars

CheerfullyInsane wrote:See under Front, Flanks & Rear in the help-file. There's a diagram explaining what they mean by "....a line extending across the rear...."

This is exactly where I copied the text from, and the text that you quoted is not in that section, where is it?

Moreover, the point I'm trying to make is that units attached in the rear DO NOT always suffer a cohesion loss as stated in your post, and the quote does not make any reference to exceptions to the rule. So why do units sometimes not lose cohesion when attacked in the rear?

Units only lose cohesion when the charger starts to the rear of the unit. Charging units that reach the rear from another position still get POAs for a rear attack, but the defender dosen't drop a step in cohension.

Deeter

76mm wrote:

CheerfullyInsane wrote:See under Front, Flanks & Rear in the help-file. There's a diagram explaining what they mean by "....a line extending across the rear...."

This is exactly where I copied the text from, and the text that you quoted is not in that section, where is it?

Moreover, the point I'm trying to make is that units attached in the rear DO NOT always suffer a cohesion loss as stated in your post, and the quote does not make any reference to exceptions to the rule. So why do units sometimes not lose cohesion when attacked in the rear?

Hmm I think the quote about rear charges does contain the exceptions
basically to IMPACT ie charge a unit and get the "rear hit" the attacking unit needs to start behind a plane behind the attacked unit....
if this applies then , the unit is hit in rear and:
A suffers an immediate cohesion hit
b then is at a automatic -- for POA in the impact resolution....
the exceptions:
LH or LF do NOT get the automatic rear hit cohesion drop on the enemy bg nor the --
unless (exception to the exception) the unit hit in the rear is ALSO LF or LH

I think the manual is confusing in regards to what happens when melee is resolved and you have a unit "sandwiched" between two enemy units ... If I understand correctly, if the unit cant turn it facing it suffers a cohesion test penalty (assuming it needs to test)

If you are experiancing units NOT dropping an automatic cohesion level when hit in the rear, ist make sure it was a legitimate rear impact The diagram in the manual is pretty good at illustrating this and sometimes it seems like you are impacting the rear when you really arnt (at least a Legal rear hit) If that is not the issue then maybe post a screenie for the tech area in case of a bug

76mm wrote:

CheerfullyInsane wrote:See under Front, Flanks & Rear in the help-file. There's a diagram explaining what they mean by "....a line extending across the rear...."

This is exactly where I copied the text from, and the text that you quoted is not in that section, where is it?

Moreover, the point I'm trying to make is that units attached in the rear DO NOT always suffer a cohesion loss as stated in your post, and the quote does not make any reference to exceptions to the rule. So why do units sometimes not lose cohesion when attacked in the rear?

Well, it's in my 1.3.5 manual at any rate, and it's also here.
http://www.hexwar.com/field-of-glory/he ... -rear.aspx
Also contains the diagram.
But basically what has been posted above is correct; an attack in the rear-arc is not necessarily a rear-attack.
If the charging units swing around the side during the charge, it's a 'normal' charge.

Lars

CheerfullyInsane wrote:

76mm wrote:

CheerfullyInsane wrote:See under Front, Flanks & Rear in the help-file. There's a diagram explaining what they mean by "....a line extending across the rear...."

This is exactly where I copied the text from, and the text that you quoted is not in that section, where is it?

Moreover, the point I'm trying to make is that units attached in the rear DO NOT always suffer a cohesion loss as stated in your post, and the quote does not make any reference to exceptions to the rule. So why do units sometimes not lose cohesion when attacked in the rear?

Well, it's in my 1.3.5 manual at any rate, and it's also here.
http://www.hexwar.com/field-of-glory/he ... -rear.aspx
Also contains the diagram.
But basically what has been posted above is correct; an attack in the rear-arc is not necessarily a rear-attack.
You the charging units swing around the side during the charge, it's a 'normal' charge.

Lars

It's not a completely normal charge. You should still get the ++POA for impacting the enemy rear, just not cause the double cohesion drop. So it's still an advantage, just not as much of one.

Chris

batesmotel wrote: It's not a completely normal charge. You should still get the ++POA for impacting the enemy rear, just not cause the double cohesion drop. So it's still an advantage, just not as much of one.

Chris

Granted, just as a flank-attack gives better POA too.
My point was that it won't give you automatic cohesion drops.
I can't very well go around calling them 'slightly abnormal' charges merely because they give you a ++POA.

Lars