Slitherine

I am after some advice. After an absence of about 15 years I am getting back into wargaming. Previously I was fairly well stuck in the 20mm WW2 era.

Now I have decided I want to game conflicts in the dark ages basically a spin off from reading books by Bernard Cornwall.

Scale was'nt a problem - I cant see anything to paint below 28mm

I then started looking for a ruleset. My research has rightly or wrongly led me to the conclusion that there are two large camps as far as rules are concerned, WAB and FOG. Perhaps I should also add that my chosen rule set have to be simple enough for a 10 year old to pick up. I dont necessarily want large scale conflicts (although in time wont rule that out) I want to be able to play a game in an evening and enjoy it

What does FOG offer that WAB does'nt.

Any views, opinions etc would be appreciated

Cheers

Fortytwa

fortytwa wrote:I am after some advice. After an absence of about 15 years I am getting back into wargaming. Previously I was fairly well stuck in the 20mm WW2 era.

Now I have decided I want to game conflicts in the dark ages basically a spin off from reading books by Bernard Cornwall.

Scale was'nt a problem - I cant see anything to paint below 28mm

I then started looking for a ruleset. My research has rightly or wrongly led me to the conclusion that there are two large camps as far as rules are concerned, WAB and FOG. Perhaps I should also add that my chosen rule set have to be simple enough for a 10 year old to pick up. I dont necessarily want large scale conflicts (although in time wont rule that out) I want to be able to play a game in an evening and enjoy it

What does FOG offer that WAB does'nt.

Any views, opinions etc would be appreciated

Cheers

Fortytwa

Sorry don't know about WAB but I can tell you what I enjoy about FOG these are just what I find good about them:

1. I like the BG's idea a unit that looks like a unit call me old fasioned.

2. The way that the game can flow between two players or four if your into doubles.

3. The fact that you can quickly have a game and make sense out of it even if your new to the game. Also its down to the rule writers not over loading the rules with every little aspect that may happen.

I am sure there are people on here can say it better than me, last thing the people that play FOG for the most part are a good set of players.

I have not played much WAB but have watched games in play at the club.

To me WAB looks and feels more like a big skirmish with long weapon ranges and rapid movement. If you are into the dark ages, Normans, Vikings and Saxons et al. then I think WAB works very well. If you want to play classical battles then I think WAB breaks down.

Things like an elephant is essentially just that, one elephant but if you want to play a big battle then you really need an elephant to represent 10 or more. Every unit ends up with an officer, standard bearer and musician each of which give some special benefit and if that specific figure dies then the benefit goes away. All this is fine in skirmish but when 24 legionaries are representing a cohort for 3 of them to be special figures seems wrong.

FoG has been designed top down so the battle works as a battle. WAB is designed bottom up so each model is significant but getting the big battle effect is a bit of a kludge.

FoG and WAB can both be played by 10 year olds or at least by intelligent 10 year olds with a half decent attention span.

My 11 year old son enjoys playing FoG and has done so for over a year (so he started when he was 10). He found the rulebook easy and enjoyable to read and enjoys playing FoG. I have no experience of WAB (although my son also plays WH40K and enjoys that). Therefore don't have any concerns about a 10 year old being able to play and enjoy FoG.

fortytwa wrote:
Now I have decided I want to game conflicts in the dark ages basically a spin off from reading books by Bernard Cornwall.

Fortytwa

Great series of books, convinced me to make an anglo-saxon army. I've decided to make my Inspired COmmander one certain Uhtred of Bebbanburg.

If you haven't found miniatures that are cheap and well detailed, I suggest Wargames Factory. Although the are plastic, they are fantastic.

thanks to everyone who has taken the time to reply.

I am going to build up my troops and then visit a wargames show and speak to gamers and see what comes.

I have been waiting for the plastic vikings from the Wargames Factory - in fact the plastic saxons look really good also

happy days

Fortytwa

Might be worth getting in touch with Ben Osborne on this - I was chatting with him and playing Dark Ages games in WAB and FoG cropped up so I suspect he could help with your questions; he is "benos" on this forum IIRC so try PMing that.

FOG is intended to represent large battles, and IMO is not simple enough for most 10 year olds to pick up. If you want to play the kind of dark age battles appearing in Bernard Cornwall novels, then WAB might be more suited to your requirements.

You might want to ask this on TMP, where you will get advice about other rulesets as well (even if you don't ask for it !)

I'll make the maybe obvious comment that for me it depends on what your opponents are willing to play/use.

Also, if you ware willing to do some sabot bases and compromise a little, then you can base the figs individual 20x20 as for WAB and then combine them for FoG. The heavy foot have 3 vs 4 figs per base but it works well. I admit that's what I am planning to do for Vikings which were based for WAB/skirmish games.

This period works really well for those types of games - the Pig Wars set works very well for this period, which may provide another use for your figs.