Slitherine

I have been keeping records of FOG games and I thought that since I have 100 multiplayer battles I would post some of the info. Here are the scenarios played and the winning armies. See if they match up to your experiences.

Carrhea 53 BC Roman
Cisalpine Gaul 105 BC Roman
Clastium 222BC Gallic
Clastium 222BC Roman
Clastium 222BC Gallic
Clastium 222BC Gallic
Clastium 222BC Gallic
Clusiam 225 BC Gallic
Corinth 146 BC Roman
Corinth 146 BC Roman
Corinth 146 BC Achaean League
Corinth 146 BC Roman
Corinth 146 BC Roman
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Dertosa 215 BC Roman
Dertosa 215 BC Roman
Dertosa 215 BC Roman
Heraclea 280 BC Pyrrhic
Heraclea 280 BC Pyrrhic
Heraclea 280 BC Pyrrhic
Heraclea 280 BC Pyrrhic
Heraclea 280 BC Roman
Heraclea 280 BC Roman
Heraclea 280 BC Pyrrhic
Indistavio 16 AD German
Indistavio 16 AD Roman
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Macedonian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Lyginus River 335 BC Tie
Lyginus River 335 BC Macedonian
Lyginus River 335 BC Macedonian
Metaurus 207BC Carthaginian
Metaurus 207BC Carthaginian
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Tie
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Roman
Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Roman
Mons Graupius 84AD Roman
Pharsalus 48 BC Pompey
Pharsalus 48 BC Pompey
Pharsalus 48 BC Ceasar
Sambre 57BC Roman
Sambre 57BC Roman
Sambre 57BC Belgic
Scirthaea 103 BC Roman
Scirthaea 103 BC Slave
Scirthaea 103 BC Roman
Scirthaea 103 BC Tie
Scirthaea 103 BC Slave
Scirthaea 103 BC Roman
Scirthaea 103 BC Slave
Silarus River 71 BC Roman
Silarus River 71 BC Slave
Silarus River 71 BC Slave
Silarus River 71 BC Roman
Silarus River 71 BC Roman
Starter Army Battle 1 Carthaginian
Starter Army Battle 1 Carthaginian
Starter Army Battle 1 Roman
Starter Army Battle 2 Roman
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Seleucid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 3 Indian
Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Ticinus 218 BC Carthaginian
Ticinus River 218 BC Carthaginian
Ticinus River 218 BC Roman
Ticinus River 218 BC Roman
Tunis 255 BC Roman
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Tie
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Ancient British
Verulamium 60 AD Roman
Verulamium 60 AD Roman

Invasion of Macedon 279BC Macedonian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian
Invasion of Macedon 279BC Galatian

I have to say, this seems fairly accurate. I've had good luck with the Macedonians on this map, but the Galatian superior impact troops are really difficult to overcome. Macedonia definitely gets better cavalry, and can seize the western hill first, but the centre line is thoroughly outclassed and really needs to hunker down and wait for help.

The Galatians will make a powerful force when the army lists come out. Both sides are equal points value in this scenario!

Starter Army Battle 2 Roman
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Seleucid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid

The seleucids are quite tasty too. Anyone that can regularly slaughter superior legionaries has got to be good.

The killer in the Starter Army 2 battle is mostly the fact that the Seleucids have significantly more BGs and that the drilled Seleucid cataphracts are much more useful than the undrilled, protected Roman cavalry. If those two armies are equal points I think the point system may need a re-vamp.

Chris

Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian

Metaurus 207BC Carthaginian
Metaurus 207BC Roman
Metaurus 207BC Roman

Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Caledonian
Mons Graupius 84AD Roman
Mons Graupius 84AD Roman

Starter Army Battle 1 Carthaginian
Starter Army Battle 1 Roman
Starter Army Battle 1 Roman
Starter Army Battle 1 Roman
Starter Army Battle 1 Roman

Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Seleucid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Selecuid
Starter Army Battle 2 Roman

Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Starter Army Battle 3 Macedonian
Starter Army Battle 3 Indian ....my competition game woohoo!

Tunis 255 BC Roman
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Carthaginian
Tunis 255 BC Roman

These are some of my latest games (in my favorite scenarios) for what it is worth. I am not tell which are wins and which are losses though!

Xiccarph wrote: Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian
Cynoscephalae 197 BC Macedonian

This is probably my favorite scenario overall. With historical deployment I've found that each side wins about equally often.

Chris

The killer bit about the Seleucids are that they dont have a weak link. Every bit of their army is useful and generally better than your army's equivalent troop type! And this is why they are number 1 on the Tabletop too. But all this makes it sooo sadisfying when you beat them!

Ptolemaics rule!!

This is probably my favorite scenario overall. With historical deployment I've found that each side wins about equally often.

Agreed, this is a great battle, nicely balanced. Both right wings are strong and the key to victory in this game.

So far my favorite from the new battles has to be 'Agricola Moves North', LOTS of terrain options, lots of decisions to make on both sides. Love it.

I can't disagree with the following list being good entertaining battles (not too biased to either side)
Cynoscephalae 197 BC
Metaurus 207BC
Mons Graupius 84AD
Starter Army Battle 1
Starter Army Battle 2
Starter Army Battle 3
Tunis 255 BC

The other one that I'd add for entertainment is the Hereclea battle. I've won and lost with both sides and always look forward to the challenge!

I created the Starter Army 2 scenario after seeing Carthage get routinely slaughtered in the SA 1 game. I think Rome has too much cavalry, so I gave the Seleucids a bunch of Cataphracts. Still, it is drawn from the SA list in the book and the points are 366 for Seleucids to 333 for Rome. Keith tweaked the OOB a bit.

The Seleucids are tough, but can be beaten. Last time I played it, the Roman HF tore through my average pikes in short order -- long before I could win on the flanks. Playing as Rome, I tend to grab some terrain like the big hill and fight from there. I'm glad people are playing and enjoying it. I never expected it to be in a patch.

Deeter

P.S. I think Heraclea is a real hoot!

Hi!
Interesting thread! thanks for the balanced battles list

Regarding Starter Army Battle 1 scenario, i'm currently playing it PBEM it as the Carthaginian against two roman opponents and finding it VERY hard not to lose.
IMHO its very unbalanced if romans favour: legionaries are very powerfull and they also have a big advantage in quality too (superior and elite vs average cartaginians). The Punics have more cavalry, but most of its light and not that decisive.
My average African infantry, Gauls and Spaniards can't hold the legions even for 2 turns before massively routing...
Even against the Ai, the Carthaginians have to work pretty hard to win. As the romans against the AI it's not a battle but a slaughter

I'm not a TT game player so i may be assuming wrong, but.. aren't that Starter Army battles supposedly balanced setups made with two typical armies of the same points??
It's balanced in the TT game?? if it's so, there must be something in the rules adaptation to he computer that unbalanced it
What do you TT and PC version veterans think?? or am i just a lousy player??
Cheers!

I've said it before and others don't agree, but in the TT lists leaders are not units. In the PC game, they often become extra cavalry which gives Rome as many cav as Carthage and the Punic cavalry is all they have to beat Rome. That said, if you use your medium foot like cav, it helps against Rome.

Deeter

Oh, i see! thanks
Yes, it makes sense...basically the romans get 2xequites... the real ones and the leaders cavalry
i guess using legionary battle groups for the leaders (like in other battles) would make much more sense
For using the medium foot as cav, i guess you mean for enveloping the roman wings??
I usually manage to envelope and rout their cavalry and allied infantry without much problem... but when the cav wheel to attacks the roman rear "Cannae style" they find the Carthaginian center is no more and the battle is already over

I juts tried Heraclea as Morbio suggested and found it great fun playing as the Phyrrics (even the AI made me sweat a little )
Cheers

There is no additional cavalry given, we just allocate cavalry units to leaders. In Rise of Rome you'll be able to decide which units to allocate your leader to when building the army.

I assume there's a points sytem in RoR ? Has it been reworked or is it the same as the TT game ?