Slitherine

added a new close combat capability: Pole Arms

Steady Pole Arms will reduce enemy impact POA of Knightly Lancers by 25, and melee POA of Mounted Swordsmen by 50
If Armoured or better, still 100 instead of 110.
The rest are the same as Heavy Weapon.

Mounted can dismount in battle now if unmoved, as long as the enemy is not within two squares of Mounted and not facing within 90 degrees of it.
The unit will lose all AP after the dismount manoeuvre.









Heavy Weapon has been replaced by Pole Arms in the following units:
Billmen
Raw Billmen
Swiss Halberdiers
Halberdiers
Scandinavian Foot
Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen
Swiss Halberdiers (Later)
Billmen and Longbowmen
Voynuk Foot
Swiss Pikemen
Landsknecht Pikemen
Pikemen
Raw Pikemen
Swiss Pikemen
Feudal Pikemen


Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 50 because it has 25% pike


Download:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Au7kvvu2luQ5kA8kd44 ... 7?e=6a4pXH

computerbi wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 2:11 am added a new close combat capability: Pole Arms

steady Pole Arms will reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 25, and melee POA of Mounted Swordsmen by 50(except cataphracts it's 25)
If Armoured or better, still 100 instead of 110.
The rest are the same as Heavy Weapon

Heavy Weapon has been replaced by Pole Arms in the following units:
Billmen
Raw Billmen
Swiss Halberdiers
Halberdiers
Scandinavian Foot
Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen
Swiss Halberdiers (Later)
Billmen and Longbowmen
Voynuk Foot

Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 50 because it has 25% pike

https://onedrive.live.com/?id=39E496B6F ... b6fbbee4ee

This looks very interesting.

I have a few questions though:

Would it be worth giving the various Medieval Pike units (including the Swiss and Landsknechts) 20% Polearms, instead of the current 20% Heavy Weapon? They were armed with halberds, not axe like weapons.

Why the advantage given to Cataphracts in melee? They are no more heavily armoured than Men at Arms.

cheers

Paul

Paul59 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 5:55 pm

computerbi wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 2:11 am added a new close combat capability: Pole Arms

steady Pole Arms will reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 25, and melee POA of Mounted Swordsmen by 50(except cataphracts it's 25)
If Armoured or better, still 100 instead of 110.
The rest are the same as Heavy Weapon

Heavy Weapon has been replaced by Pole Arms in the following units:
Billmen
Raw Billmen
Swiss Halberdiers
Halberdiers
Scandinavian Foot
Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen
Swiss Halberdiers (Later)
Billmen and Longbowmen
Voynuk Foot

Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 50 because it has 25% pike

https://onedrive.live.com/?id=39E496B6F ... b6fbbee4ee

This looks very interesting.

Would it be worth giving the various Medieval Pike units (including the Swiss and Landsknechts) 20% Polearms, instead of the current 20% Heavy Weapon?

Functionality-wise, it won't change after replacement except for Feudal Pikemen(if FRAGMENTED), but I'm not sure it's a good idea to replace it in terms of historical accuracy.
Thank you for your suggestion. I've changed it.

I don't think it should matter at all if added to the existing pike units, as Lancer and Sword canceling as done by Spear/Pike units is already dependent on the units being Steady. If the 80% pike 20% HW unit is steady, it essentially acts as if it is 100% Pike, except with negating 10 Armor Advantage and the 15 Overlappers POA. When the unit is fragged, it gets no Pike POA and thus no canceling effects, instead devolving to the 20% HW, which regardless of POAs is fairly worthless while fragged.

So, keeping to the same design philosophy, Unsteady Polearms should not have POA canceling abilities, when Unsteady Spears and Pikes don't either.

SnuggleBunnies wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 12:40 am I don't think it should matter at all if added to the existing pike units, as Lancer and Sword canceling as done by Spear/Pike units is already dependent on the units being Steady. If the 80% pike 20% HW unit is steady, it essentially acts as if it is 100% Pike, except with negating 10 Armor Advantage and the 15 Overlappers POA. When the unit is fragged, it gets no Pike POA and thus no canceling effects, instead devolving to the 20% HW, which regardless of POAs is fairly worthless while fragged.

So, keeping to the same design philosophy, Unsteady Polearms should not have POA canceling abilities, when Unsteady Spears and Pikes don't either.

The POA cancel ability of Polearms only exists in STEADY, if a unit has both spear/pike and polearms, it will take the highest value e.g. Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen(25% pike, 75% pole arms) cancel 50 impact poa of lancers

computerbi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 1:57 am

Yup, and thus if you switched out 20% HW for 20% polearms it would be a purely cosmetic change.

Paul59 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 5:55 pm

computerbi wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 2:11 am added a new close combat capability: Pole Arms

steady Pole Arms will reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 25, and melee POA of Mounted Swordsmen by 50(except cataphracts it's 25)
If Armoured or better, still 100 instead of 110.
The rest are the same as Heavy Weapon

Heavy Weapon has been replaced by Pole Arms in the following units:
Billmen
Raw Billmen
Swiss Halberdiers
Halberdiers
Scandinavian Foot
Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen
Swiss Halberdiers (Later)
Billmen and Longbowmen
Voynuk Foot

Swiss Halberdiers and Pikemen reduce enemy impact POA of Lancers/Knightly Lancers by 50 because it has 25% pike

https://onedrive.live.com/?id=39E496B6F ... b6fbbee4ee

This looks very interesting.

I have a few questions though:

Would it be worth giving the various Medieval Pike units (including the Swiss and Landsknechts) 20% Polearms, instead of the current 20% Heavy Weapon? They were armed with halberds, not axe like weapons.

Why the advantage given to Cataphracts in melee? They are no more heavily armoured than Men at Arms.

cheers

Paul

Because of the original rules, cataphracts have a reduction POA cancelling ability of steady spear/pike. Other mounted Swordsmen have 0 POA vs steady pike/spearmen, but cataphracts have 50. Maybe I should change the original rules, either by removing this ability of cataphracts or giving the fully armoured mounted unit the same ability for the reason that their horses are armored.

computerbi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 6:45 am
Because of the original rules, cataphracts have a reduction POA cancelling ability of steady spear/pike. Other mounted Swordsmen have 0 POA vs steady pike/spearmen, but cataphracts have 50. Maybe I should change the original rules, either by removing this ability of cataphracts or giving the fully armoured mounted unit the same ability for the reason that their horses are armored.

Maybe hold fire on that for a while, and let's have a think about it. I'm sure RBS brought that change in for cataphracts for a very good reason, but I can't remember what it was! Perhaps SnuggleBunnies remembers? Anyway, it might be preferable to keep the cataphract advantage.

Edit: I think it was to give the Byzantine Klibanophoroi a boost in melee.

SnuggleBunnies wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 2:32 am

computerbi wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 1:57 am

Yup, and thus if you switched out 20% HW for 20% polearms it would be a purely cosmetic change.

Which is still useful, as it will keep some people happy!

This really should be official.

Paul59 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 11:12 am

This was to boost catas a bit in general, and to reflect their seeming tendency to engage rather more willingly in extended melees than other cavalry. Knights don't need the boost frankly, and in any case seemed to charge in and out quite often.