Slitherine

We have evidence from visual arts of bill-style heavy weapons used by Italian late 13th and early 14th century infantrymen.
Example from 1316 (see upper right of the image):


Our question would be as follows: Does anyone know what was the name for this weapon (and these infantrymen) in the early 14th century?

In later periods this weapon would be mostly referred to as the roncone and the men as ronconieri and the weapon persisted well into the 15th century. Can anyone confirm if this would be the same name used in 13th/14th centuries?

in German it's called a Roßschinder or Rossschinder (= "steed maltreater", "horse molester")

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rossschinder
https://www.hermann-historica.de/de/auc ... t/id/18566
http://www.larpwiki.de/Ro%C3%9Fschinder

If I am not mistaken, in the FoG system, when it is likely that infantrymen with heavy cutting weapons, spears or swords fought together in mixed units, they are treated as Spearmen (offensive or defensive). It seems that the picture in OP shows such mixed units.

Athos1660 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:00 pm If I am not mistaken, in the FoG system, when it is likely that infantrymen with heavy cutting weapons, spears or swords fought together in mixed units, they are treated as Spearmen (offensive or defensive). It seems that the picture in OP shows such mixed units.

That is correct, although in the FOG table top army lists the Communal Italians can field a small number of Heavy Weapon units, probably because Ian Heath (in Armies of Feudal Europe) mentions axe men being popular in Cremona and other towns. I don't know why RBS decided not to include them in FOG2M lists. BTW, an early version of the Islesmen texture was much more "civilised" looking than the current one and would have been ideal to represent an Italian HW unit.

Another example of mixed units at the battle of Courtrai (1302)


(from the Chroniques de France, late 14th century)

(I for one don't know if this mixing here describes an actual formation or if it is an artistic 'simplification')

Paul59 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:57 pm I don't know why RBS decided not to include them in FOG2M lists.

Fortunately, Richard keeps on fine-tuning his army lists

Paul59 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:57 pm

Athos1660 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:00 pm If I am not mistaken, in the FoG system, when it is likely that infantrymen with heavy cutting weapons, spears or swords fought together in mixed units, they are treated as Spearmen (offensive or defensive). It seems that the picture in OP shows such mixed units.

That is correct, although in the FOG table top army lists the Communal Italians can field a small number of Heavy Weapon units, probably because Ian Heath (in Armies of Feudal Europe) mentions them being popular in Cremona and other towns. I don't know why RBS decided not to include them in FOG2M lists. BTW, an early version of the Islesmen texture was much more "civilised" looking than the current one and would have been ideal to represent an Italian HW unit.

The next update for our mod will include Itanian armylists and we do plan to have a small number of HW units.

We have been debating what to call them, since the name "Ronconieri" would be perfect in the 15th century. By that time the name roncone became widely used and recognized. For example we have the word used in the Florentine city statues from 1415 (about limitations on carrying weapons inside the city).

We know units armed with the exact same type of weapon appeared as early as the late 13th century at Campaldino etc. But we aren't sure if the name "roncone" would not be anachronistic in the 13th and early 14th centuries.

In English the weapon is clearly a bill. Derived from the agricultural billhook, and a very common weapon in English armies in the 14th through 16th centuries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billhook

It's a bill. If it had a vertical spike it would be a bill-guisarme