Slitherine

Turn 36


This is the turn when things started to go wrong.

LABS
Def tech for inf and at tech for arm still not available.


MEDITERRANEAN BEFORE:

Something is going on. UK has Libya and all NA army is free to attack Italy.
Sicily is practically undefended. If I had 2 ital corps in Sicily, at that moment, I would have felt safe.



MEDITERRANEAN AFTER:

I think this was a huge overreaction. I sent 2 paras, 1 corps, 3 fgts (german, ital, romanian), 1 ital tac.

My idea was that I didn't need those non-german air units in east anyway, because of the coming winter.

Regarding to your tech :

1 It is normal if INF defence lvl 2 complete before bad weather 1941 .& it is usually acceptable . ( upgrade before winter)

2 since you concentrate on Bliz , the arm tech lab is only 2 , the progress is also reasonable .


Regarding to the reaction of Italy , I seldom use Italian air force to against RAF . They are too weak & Italy has low pp income to supply the dogfight loss . I only use them in USSR to do some airsupport job.

But anyway , Italy has to be defended well in 1942 .

Back to Morris about:

As I said, from this turn I little by little gave you power to lead my game. With your initiatives you made me believe that I just have to react to your attacks and make moves that were not based of my own planning.

Everyone knows your superior capability to build big concentrations of troops. In addition to this, my resources in particular battles were even smaller, because of running around and reacting to you initiatives.

TURN 36, EAST FRONT, NORTH

I've drawn circles around German units that are already far a way from front. I'm strong, but Soviets are faster. How should I use my strenght? There are plenty of troops south of Tallinn. But for some reason, I never attacked it.



Soviets are very strong around Kalinin. The original idea was to cause casualties. Here they are, but I'm afraid I'm not going to be strong enough here. I was not after Moscow, but he had to defend it, anyway.

I also need units for Leningrad. In after pic I've a German unit in Helsinki harbor.


TURN 36, EAST FRONT, SOUTH



My plan was to place my winter defense line along Dnepr. Gomel is part of Dnepr defense line, but maybe I invested too much in order to take it?

I attacked further to Donets in order to pursue retreating Soviets. This proved to be useless. How does is look like, was I strong enough to go further for real? Maybe I've already scattered my units in too many directions? Is Donets a realistic defense line for 1941 (against Morris)?



There are so many units around Odessa after finishing the pocket.

CASUALTIES
Turn 36, start

TURN 37

Aug 21st 1941 fair

Still no upgrade.



MEDITERRANEAN

Before

I was afraid of an immediate landing, but maybe his intention was to
-make me send units from Russia (also rail points effect)
-bombard my units with BB:s
-win naval/air battles

He didn't have an airbase for tacs available, so his chances for successful landing were limited, if you think about it afterwards. It was only late 1941.



After

Fighters have arrived, but they can't reach Sicily! So what was the point to send them here? If I put them closer, his BB:s would bombard them. Overreaction here means that I didn't analyze the situation properly, I was just in a hurry to send there what was available.



RUSSIA, NORTH

Before

Two partisans arrived next to my air units, I had to get rid of them. There is still 4 reserve units in Estonia. Novgorod and Kalinin task groups would have appreciated one of them, both.



After
The units for taking Leningrad have arrived Finland. Two task groups are approaching Kalinin. Commanding air units are lead my Manstein. Germans should have more units in Novgorod area (but those units are somewhere in Ukraine doing nothing!) But everything is still in control.



RUSSIA, SOUTH

Tacs lack leader support. Placing them should have been more disciplined.



There are five task groups. The one for Sevastopol is too weak. Gomel and Rostov are ok. The rest two are idle. Summer is over, soon.


CASUALTIES

Before



After

Axis keep on killing non-motorised units, but mechs are intact.

at first , I have to thanks Mr Pekka to make this AAR feeling much better !

Finland1944 wrote:TURN 37

Aug 21st 1941 fair


MEDITERRANEAN

Before

I was afraid of an immediate landing, but maybe his intention was to
-make me send units from Russia (also rail points effect)
-bombard my units with BB:s
-win naval/air battles

He didn't have an airbase for tacs available, so his chances for successful landing were limited, if you think about it afterwards. It was only late 1941.



After

Fighters have arrived, but they can't reach Sicily! So what was the point to send them here? If I put them closer, his BB:s would bombard them. Overreaction here means that I didn't analyze the situation properly, I was just in a hurry to send there what was available.

I never really want to land in Sicily in 1941 unless Axis has no troops to defend it . Without tacs support ,it is a mission impossible . BTW, UK has only 1 landing point & 35 pp is still too expensive for UK around that period .

But it is the only way we can help Russians in 1941 especially under our house rule of this pbem .

TURN 38

MEDITERRANEAN

Before

Because I wasn't aware of his limited landing capability, I was worried about the coast of Sicily, and cutting off the tip of boot. This was good historical realism, Axis didn't know it, they didn't have the manual, it was possible to fool them).




After

The defense of Italy is secured. Mussolini is satisfied and ready to continue the war. Let's have a look at the German posse:
1 mech, 2 FJ, 3 corps, 1 fgt

Of course I realized that those units were from east, but I didn't realize that situation in Ukraine was alarming. My focus was in Italy and Leningrad. Good job, Morris.



In addition to all this I'm ready to send some leaders to Italy in case of urgent despair. I call this overkill defense. But mafia influential enough to protect their territory.



+++++++++++++++++++

RUSSIA, NORTH

Before



After

There is a strong task group ready to attack Leningrad. Manstein moved from Pskov to lead them.

There is a natural defense line next to Kalinin. Finnish attack toward Ural is a little bit out of control. ("Toward Ural" was a slogan of some Finnish leaders in 1941.) They are vulnerable to counter attack. And there is no point to advance so far.

It's still difficult for me to understand why those units in Estonia are not fighting in Novgorod, which is part of the intended winter defense line.

Tanks and tacs are waiting for upgrade.




Here are two alternative defense lines. They are almost equally long. Green one is 7+3+3 and yellow 12 + 3, but the latter one is more vulnerable, when you have to retreat from it, or if Soviet break in at Mogilev. Any Ideas about placing defense line in northern Russia?




RUSSIA, SOUTH

Before

Soviets can send units through Kerch. But it's too late to block it. Mud will arrive soon, I had only one good unit for the job.

Somehow Soviet gar managed to pass my ZOC to Kharkov?!



After
(pic corrupted)

Gomel and Rostov taken. It's time to prepare for Soviet winter attack. But wait a minute, I really do have too much troops in north and Italy, because I've so few of them here!! At this point, I didn't realize how critical the situation was. You don't need a strong army to walk across so deserted Ukraine from east to west.


CASUALTIES

Before



After

Pekka's plan is good ,but the Red army won't just sit as1940's French ! They will attack Axis 's weak point whenever they are ready !

Pekkas spearheads are dangerously exposed and weak. With no fighter or bomber scouting the way in front a counter attack can come att any time. Like now would be a good time to strike for the russians. Germans are scattered, luftwaffe not in position to make a significant difference, so they wont be able to retaliate if the russians attack.

Its even so bad the russians can use the rail link to kharkov and put som infantry the to cut off german retreat.
Also we all know that morris likes to keep stronger forces in the south

There was no intention to advance any further to east, but one can ask, if this is already too far.

Air recce is good suggestion how I could have improved. I was just thinking about Soviet SW offensive. And railing up to 3 units Kharkov is really a nasty plot. Thanks, Crazygunner.

TURN 39

On September 30, 1941, before mud, Soviets launch two surprise offensives, both in north and south.

How does this look like? Have I already made too many fatal errors, or is there still a way organize a decent defense in this kind of situation? What should I have done? Because from this on, Morris is going to kick my ass, big time.

MEDITERRANEAN

Before

Luftwaffe has 2 fgts and 1 tac available. They should be in Ukraine now.



After

Oh no, now both fgts are in Italy. (Ok, it's true, that one fgt is not very useful.) This is an after-turn pic, Axis knew about Soviet offensive.

Sub is guarding the coast near Reggio.



RUSSIA, NORTH

Before

Morris unleashed the non-motorized defenders of Moscow.

Units next to Novgorod don't try to attack the city, they are already too depleted.

The investment for Leningrad is exaggerated. The problem is that after taking the city, I can't pursuit the success immediately, so plenty of troops just have to wait.

We can see the opposite in Ukraine, where Morris has concentrated all his motorized units, and he is able to continue from victory to victory, and there is not such a thing that I has deployed too many units that would be useless.



After

Axis built a defense line. But what will happen, when SW strikes? Strange that Germans have the privilege to sunbathe in Italy, and Italians must suffer in Russian winter… Between Rzhev and Gomel there is not a single German corps! I've heard that they should be the backbone of defense?




RUSSIA, SOUTH

Before

The distance between Sevastopol and Gomel is 15 hexes. That is the length of intended defense line. On the map you can find 8 German, 5 Italian and 8 other units (no gars or air). For SW defense there is one unit for two hexes. I'm happy that Morris didn't know the situation. Or maybe he did?

There are 8 Soviet mecs and 3 tanks visible to me. As Crazygunner mentioned, with air recce they would have been visible, earlier!



After

Some air units arrive. There are 4 German mech/arm, against Soviet 11, so we are not going to witness any counter attacks. Because of free oil, I have an option for defensive air attack against his tanks, but we'll see if it will materialize…




CASUALTIES

Soon it's time to start counting how the turn of taking casualties changes from Soviets to Axis.

Before



After

It looks like you are too spread out. Not enough units to cover the whole frontline. You advanced fast everywhere but force disposition became suboptimal. Definitely too much focus on Crimea and too many units in Finland. The frontline should be shortened near Moscow - do you see these three hexes below the marshlands? That's when you should move the units that are stationed to the east of that position. And you are right, you overreacted a bit in Italy.

It seems to me that the only logical option would be to give ground in the East, sometimes even for free. Units are more important and even if the Soviets retake their cities, they will have to reconvert the railways, which will slow them down a bit.

You have many units, but they are in wrong positions. This is always a logistical challenge, but now you see that it's important to plan unit movements in advance.

Cybvep wrote:It looks like you are too spread out. Not enough units to cover the whole frontline. You advanced fast everywhere but force disposition became suboptimal. Definitely too much focus on Crimea and too many units in Finland. The frontline should be shortened near Moscow - do you see these three hexes below the marshlands? That's when you should move the units that are stationed to the east of that position.

yes , Actually Leningrad is important & worthy to take ,but I seldom go into Crimea . It will waste your troops & time & get 2 pp at most .

Leningrad is good, crimea is difficult to take out easily. As stated before you are thin where the russians are the strongest and vice verca. You need to keep your axis forces together in order to avoid an early russian counter attack such as this. Facing this i would actually forget about the defense line you are proposing, cause you wont make it in time and even if you did as soon as severe winter hits he can start attacking your line when you are the weakest. So in this case i would say that it is better to give up ground an save the whermacht intact for operations in 42

I would put up a defense line about where you have it in the north. South i would try and lure morris troops to attack and advance as long as Vinitsa and Odessa, even retake Kiev. Making sort of a fighting retreat, leaving cities defended with only corp with a def leader attached to it if possible. If you are lucky attacker might bypass them. This will create sort of a bulge in the line with a pointy sector in the center around gomel and orel. As the russians advance in the south you build up your forces around gomel or that centrer part of the sector in order to strike out south during summer 42, always careful that you are not spotted otherwise russians will attack there as well. If executed correctly russians would have been so eager to pursue the axis in the south and retake cities so the center section build up would go unnoticed. During spring and summer 42 strike south and you would have turned the russian advance into a trap. Sort of a "Mansteins miracle"

Just a suggestion......anyhow in winter 41 it is peril the axis dont take to much beating. So plan accordingly. Otherwise it will be very difficult to keep the initiative for the rest of the game as you probabaly noticed.

Crazyg

Also remember morris has done this a couple of times so he got the russians counter offensive timing down to perfection.

Crazygunner1 wrote:I would put up a defense line about where you have it in the north. South i would try and lure morris troops to attack and advance as long as Vinitsa and Odessa, even retake Kiev. Making sort of a fighting retreat, leaving cities defended with only corp with a def leader attached to it if possible. If you are lucky attacker might bypass them. This will create sort of a bulge in the line with a pointy sector in the center around gomel and orel. As the russians advance in the south you build up your forces around gomel or that centrer part of the sector in order to strike out south during summer 42, always careful that you are not spotted otherwise russians will attack there as well. If executed correctly russians would have been so eager to pursue the axis in the south and retake cities so the center section build up would go unnoticed. During spring and summer 42 strike south and you would have turned the russian advance into a trap. Sort of a "Mansteins miracle"

Crazyg

Yes ! Mr Crazyg! You did make this Manstein miracle & badly hurt Red army ! I did remember !!!

Morris wrote:

Crazygunner1 wrote:I would put up a defense line about where you have it in the north. South i would try and lure morris troops to attack and advance as long as Vinitsa and Odessa, even retake Kiev. Making sort of a fighting retreat, leaving cities defended with only corp with a def leader attached to it if possible. If you are lucky attacker might bypass them. This will create sort of a bulge in the line with a pointy sector in the center around gomel and orel. As the russians advance in the south you build up your forces around gomel or that centrer part of the sector in order to strike out south during summer 42, always careful that you are not spotted otherwise russians will attack there as well. If executed correctly russians would have been so eager to pursue the axis in the south and retake cities so the center section build up would go unnoticed. During spring and summer 42 strike south and you would have turned the russian advance into a trap. Sort of a "Mansteins miracle"

Crazyg

Yes ! Mr Crazyg! You did make this Manstein miracle & badly hurt Red army ! I did remember !!!

I did? Dont remember that one....

Crazygunner1 wrote:

Morris wrote:

Crazygunner1 wrote:I would put up a defense line about where you have it in the north. South i would try and lure morris troops to attack and advance as long as Vinitsa and Odessa, even retake Kiev. Making sort of a fighting retreat, leaving cities defended with only corp with a def leader attached to it if possible. If you are lucky attacker might bypass them. This will create sort of a bulge in the line with a pointy sector in the center around gomel and orel. As the russians advance in the south you build up your forces around gomel or that centrer part of the sector in order to strike out south during summer 42, always careful that you are not spotted otherwise russians will attack there as well. If executed correctly russians would have been so eager to pursue the axis in the south and retake cities so the center section build up would go unnoticed. During spring and summer 42 strike south and you would have turned the russian advance into a trap. Sort of a "Mansteins miracle"

Crazyg

Yes ! Mr Crazyg! You did make this Manstein miracle & badly hurt Red army ! I did remember !!!

I did? Dont remember that one....

The one you launch counterattack in the first fair turn in 1942 in Romania & killed most of my tanks & Mechs ! It seems you have too many victory memory & ignore about this one . hehehe

Oh yes i remember now....a two pronged attack. Well you are stacking up a rather large number of victories yourself

Crazygunner1 wrote:Oh yes i remember now....a two pronged attack. Well you are stacking up a rather large number of victories yourself

hehe , you are one of the only three elites( I believe you are!) which I had never got a victory against you ! ( another 2 are: Joe Rock who is the only one had both Allies & Axis victory against me ; Borger who has never given me a chance to challenge ).

Yeah...Joerock is really tough and a good player. Also fun to play against
Borger i started a game a long time ago but never got to finish it. In the short game we had it was clear that Borger plays the game well planned and almost perfectly executed. Would actually be fun to have another match

Also think Supermax quallifies into that "elite" category.