Slitherine

Morris wrote:Hi everyone :

since the AAR will have to halt after the 2.01.33 &.34 patches coming , I just to come to visit this AAR to say goodbye to you .
I do agree The Great Supermax have got great achivement in this AAR . Axis had got maybe the largest advantage which Axis could ever make . But the present Axis (Germany) manpower is around 600 & fuel around 100 , there are still around 140 INF steps need to supply ,also the GDP is much less then the total of Allies (160+ VS 250+ not including convoy ) , There are still more than two & half year to go . I believe this will be a close game in 1945 . Although Axis perform well done at the first half , it is still too early to say which side will be the winner .
Finally , I 'd like to halt our present AAR & start a new one . I prefer to play Axis to test the 2.01.33 changes . If Mr Supermax is not interested in playing with me , I do wish him have good luck in the future .

It is my great pleasure to experience the pbem with great Supermax !

Very disapointing...

Anyway, its done now Moriss stopped the game.

I will come up with a post to present my future strategies that i would have done later , and why this game was in the bag.

And, sadly, there wont be a revenge match, i am not interested at the moment. I have started a game with Richards and Zechi, and soon will be with Crazygunner as well.

supermax wrote:

Morris wrote:Hi everyone :

since the AAR will have to halt after the 2.01.33 &.34 patches coming , I just to come to visit this AAR to say goodbye to you .
I do agree The Great Supermax have got great achivement in this AAR . Axis had got maybe the largest advantage which Axis could ever make . But the present Axis (Germany) manpower is around 600 & fuel around 100 , there are still around 140 INF steps need to supply ,also the GDP is much less then the total of Allies (160+ VS 250+ not including convoy ) , There are still more than two & half year to go . I believe this will be a close game in 1945 . Although Axis perform well done at the first half , it is still too early to say which side will be the winner .
Finally , I 'd like to halt our present AAR & start a new one . I prefer to play Axis to test the 2.01.33 changes . If Mr Supermax is not interested in playing with me , I do wish him have good luck in the future .

It is my great pleasure to experience the pbem with great Supermax !

Very disapointing...

Anyway, its done now Moriss stopped the game.

I will come up with a post to present my future strategies that i would have done later , and why this game was in the bag.

And, sadly, there wont be a revenge match, i am not interested at the moment. I have started a game with Richards and Zechi, and soon will be with Crazygunner as well.

The pbem is stopped by the patch & bug not by me . Do you remember that I never complained the halt of last AAR which stopped by the Guard bug is because of you . At that time , I felt disappointed too , but I continue start a new AAR as you request without any hesitate . but now ,your choice is quit ! I do also feel deep disappointed . You can show your creative & aggressive , why can't you show your patience?

That's too bad. But thank you for an extremely entertaining AAR.

*Applause*

PionUrpo wrote:That's too bad. But thank you for an extremely entertaining AAR.

*Applause*

I feel the same way. I think there are a lot of us that will agree that we'd *love* to see this thing go on. It's been very entertaining, and very informative too.

Max says that this one's "in the bag." And, unless the game's totally broken, it surely ought to be.

Moriss points out Max's problems with manpower & oil vis a vis the Allies, but...
a) All he has to do is survive for the next 2 1/2 game-years. The Allies have to actively conquer four capitals, so they would have to have a pretty considerable advantage in oil, manpower and PP's in order to have a chance. If these 3 areas were at all equal, the Allies shouldn't really have a chance at all.
b) While German manpower is sadly (for Max) low, we must remember that Italy is still in the game too, and I would think that Max should be able to keep Italy in the game for quite a while yet. That means that he could, as things wind down, drain Italy's manpower to the last dregs in the process of slowing the Allies down, which should help quite a bit in conserving German MP. Something similar could also be said for the minor allies.

Diplomaticus wrote:

PionUrpo wrote:That's too bad. But thank you for an extremely entertaining AAR.

*Applause*

I feel the same way. I think there are a lot of us that will agree that we'd *love* to see this thing go on. It's been very entertaining, and very informative too.

Max says that this one's "in the bag." And, unless the game's totally broken, it surely ought to be.

Moriss points out Max's problems with manpower & oil vis a vis the Allies, but...
a) All he has to do is survive for the next 2 1/2 game-years. The Allies have to actively conquer four capitals, so they would have to have a pretty considerable advantage in oil, manpower and PP's in order to have a chance. If these 3 areas were at all equal, the Allies shouldn't really have a chance at all.
b) While German manpower is sadly (for Max) low, we must remember that Italy is still in the game too, and I would think that Max should be able to keep Italy in the game for quite a while yet. That means that he could, as things wind down, drain Italy's manpower to the last dregs in the process of slowing the Allies down, which should help quite a bit in conserving German MP. Something similar could also be said for the minor allies.

Italy 's manpower also less than 75% . Italian always not be able to be depended on !

I just want to point out that manpower between 50-75 only gives -1 quality. That won't affect battles that much. It's when the quality drops below 50 that the Axis gets into trouble. Then they get -1 survivability as well.

Moriss

We stopped our last game because you had 10 guards units on the map. This was a major bug.

We are stopping this game because you opened my turn, and i said that i do not mind about that and we can continue playing. So why are you claiming that the bug is stopping the game???

The patch is also non-consequential to our game since all the reserach decisions are done. you lost your whole Russian army and it has nothing to do with the patch. Tanks are more expensive, so.... You already bought a ton at cheaper price and squandered them.

After 42, patch or no patch its not possible to change research focus and gain back the gap. In the case of naval for example, even if you end up developping some naval tech, mine will be so high by then that it wont matter.

Effectivly in this game, i would have gained total naval superiority by mid 1943. And Italian would have been churning out a corps every 2 turns, and staying on the defense with the germans would have meant no oil burning.

Here is my proposal:

We continue this game AND we start 2 more, a double header Allies-Axis.

Then all will be well and the community can continue enjoying our slugging out.

supermax wrote:Here is my proposal:

We continue this game AND we start 2 more, a double header Allies-Axis.

Then all will be well and the community can continue enjoying our slugging out.

Please say yes to this proposal Morris. You guys are both excellent players, and this game and the two additional games would be very valuable to the current game balance checks, plus very entertaining for the rest of us.

BuddyGrant wrote:Please say yes to this proposal Morris. You guys are both excellent players, and this game and the two additional games would be very valuable to the current game balance checks, plus very entertaining for the rest of us.

me too!

I too would love to see this game continue.

However I think that I agree with morris, this game is not over and the allies can still win this.

I will happily take over morris's game if I need.

I think there are many years ah.ead and the german manpower and oil are heading in the wrong direction while the allied armies are in no fit state at the moment, that said they will recover.

This is an excellent aar and I have loved the play from max, but its certainly not over yet.

Its neer over till the fat lady sings but I think Morris has a real problem - how does he get to Western Europe?

Without Naval supremacy thats a tall order.

Also, I would guess the Brits have a suprise coming

I would love to see two more Max-Moriss games!

I'd also like to throw in my two cents and say I'd love to see the end of this, and the additional games.

afk_nero wrote:I too would love to see this game continue.

However I think that I agree with morris, this game is not over and the allies can still win this.

I will happily take over morris's game if I need.

I think there are many years ah.ead and the german manpower and oil are heading in the wrong direction while the allied armies are in no fit state at the moment, that said they will recover.

This is an excellent aar and I have loved the play from max, but its certainly not over yet.

We could do that, like get the developpers to give you the password...

I don't know how to retrieve a password because it's encrypted. Maybe Ronnie can do it since he wrote the encryption code.

supermax wrote:Moriss

We stopped our last game because you had 10 guards units on the map. This was a major bug.

We are stopping this game because you opened my turn, and i said that i do not mind about that and we can continue playing. So why are you claiming that the bug is stopping the game???

The patch is also non-consequential to our game since all the reserach decisions are done. you lost your whole Russian army and it has nothing to do with the patch. Tanks are more expensive, so.... You already bought a ton at cheaper price and squandered them.

After 42, patch or no patch its not possible to change research focus and gain back the gap. In the case of naval for example, even if you end up developping some naval tech, mine will be so high by then that it wont matter.

Effectivly in this game, i would have gained total naval superiority by mid 1943. And Italian would have been churning out a corps every 2 turns, and staying on the defense with the germans would have meant no oil burning.

Here is my proposal:

We continue this game AND we start 2 more, a double header Allies-Axis.

Then all will be well and the community can continue enjoying our slugging out.

Max：

At first , I have to repeat that : this AAR is stopped by the changes of 2.01.33 & the password bug . If you considered the 10- guards bug was a major bug , the password bug is also a major bug & plus the major changes from 2.01.33 patch . Regarding to this AAR ,I also had spent a lot of time , I also felt disappointed ！Not only you !
Regarding to continue this AAR , it is almost impossible for me . I do care about I had acknowledged your data , because I still believe allies still have opportunity to win . I can not afford that in case If I win ,it will be said it is benificial from reading your data . Anyway , after 2.01.33 our present AAR's mission is already accomplished .& the change in 2.01.33 about the convoy & navy will badly destroy my original strategy of navy lab . It is too late for Alllies to change back .
If you really want to finish this pbem , I have two requirement :
1 we go back to 2.01.32 & finish it by 2.01.32.
2 you open all my data & put them on the AAR ( if you can't open on 2.01.34 ,I will provide all of data to you by email ),so let everyone know that , at this point we are even .

At second , I accept your idea of open a double Header Allies -Axis game to test the present game engine .It will be a PK game ! Please advise when you will be ready for that , I will send my turn when I receive yours .

afk_nero wrote:I too would love to see this game continue.

However I think that I agree with morris, this game is not over and the allies can still win this.

I will happily take over morris's game if I need.

I think there are many years ah.ead and the german manpower and oil are heading in the wrong direction while the allied armies are in no fit state at the moment, that said they will recover.

This is an excellent aar and I have loved the play from max, but its certainly not over yet.

Thanks for your understanding . You are so brave ! But I don't think you need to waste time on it . The 2.01.33 patch did just come to aginst the allies strategy in this AAR. Allies will have to suffer more pressure not from Max but from the patch ( such as escort of convoy & etc ) . As I mentioned before 2.01.33 that: this AAR will be a close game which everthing will be clear until late 1944 or 1945 . I wonder the Allies will be not easy to hold even little the additional suffer from the patch .I suggest you take more time to concerntrate on the 2.01.34 version . But if you do insist , Good luck my friend ! I will volunteer to be your consultant if you need .

@Supermax & Morris
Please stop with this nonsense as you both do not give a good impression at it.

In your first game its obvious that Morris would have won it. Of course Morris had a big advantage as he could buy Guard units, which is not a standard setting. Nevertheless, this option has been activated by Supermax, so its not a bug, but it gave Morris a significant advantage in the game. Nevertheless, as Supermax asked to restart the game, he actually surrendered and its a victory for Morris.

In your second game the game goes clearly to Supermax, as Morris has abandoned it. The reasons for stopping the game are irrelevant. The same goes for Morris chances to still win the game, which are from my point of view rather low. Morris stopped the game and Supermax wanted to continue i.e. the Victory goes to Supermax.

Its perfectly acceptable to stop a running game, if one of the players feels that the game is not fun for him anymore. Nobody wants to force a player to play in his freetime a game which he does not have fun with. Nevertheless, if one player abandons/stops/surrenders the game, for whatever reasons, its a Victory for the other player of course. So this game goes to Supermax

I would say that you are even and you should go for a decisive game

zechi wrote:@Supermax & Morris
In your first game its obvious that Morris would have won it. Of course Morris had a big advantage as he could buy Guard units, which is not a standard setting. Nevertheless, this option has been activated by Supermax, so its not a bug, but it gave Morris a significant advantage in the game. Nevertheless, as Supermax asked to restart the game, he actually surrendered and its a victory for Morris.

That is not right. It was actually a bug regarding the 1941 guards limits. It was set to 6 because we were thinking about having enough for the 4 Shock armies arriving late in 1941. Those are considered guards.

The bug was because we hadn't thought of people buying guards before the shock armies arrive. So Morris had already bought up to the limit and got 4 more for free, thus ending up with 10 guards. That was 4 more than the max limit set by the game. THAT is the bug we're talking about. Not that Morris was able to purchase guards.

He just got more than he should have had according to the intention of the rules.

Stauffenberg wrote:

zechi wrote:@Supermax & Morris
In your first game its obvious that Morris would have won it. Of course Morris had a big advantage as he could buy Guard units, which is not a standard setting. Nevertheless, this option has been activated by Supermax, so its not a bug, but it gave Morris a significant advantage in the game. Nevertheless, as Supermax asked to restart the game, he actually surrendered and its a victory for Morris.

That is not right. It was actually a bug regarding the 1941 guards limits. It was set to 6 because we were thinking about having enough for the 4 Shock armies arriving late in 1941. Those are considered guards.

The bug was because we hadn't thought of people buying guards before the shock armies arrive. So Morris had already bought up to the limit and got 4 more for free, thus ending up with 10 guards. That was 4 more than the max limit set by the game. THAT is the bug we're talking about. Not that Morris was able to purchase guards.

He just got more than he should have had according to the intention of the rules.

I never played the option of purchsing guards before that AAR . But Max Chose that , I asked to close this option ,but I did not receive any confirmation from him .He thought we got a deal . I thought he rejected my suggestion .Then we met to the bug . The bug was not our fault .

Anyway , i can accept to throw these borning & meaningless argument away , & start the decisive game .