Slitherine

WombatDazzler wrote:My issue is whole armies that have no link to their historical counterparts. If you like sashimonos run late samurai.

Sashimono are late, in the sense that they are out of period late. I'll run what I like, and not be particularly bothered by comments to be honest.

Ian

nikgaukroger wrote:

DaiSho wrote: However, I've never seen anyone complain about people (in ancients) turning up with out of period figures

Lived a sheltered life have we?

Don't think so... although perhaps Aussies are less bothered by this than our American/British cousins.

In pretty much every convention I've attended to date there has been someone with 'the wrong figures'.

Ian

Well then fully plate armored knights being used as Crusaders should also not bother you than. Since my favorite armor is Gothic style plate. Much more "Mean" than Maximillian or silly old chain mail.

I mean after all this is what I like in a armored knight and it looks no more out of place to me than a 1600 Samurai playing in the Gempi war. But fear not DaiSho. I do not think we will ever cross tourny paths because if I ever make it to the "Land down under" Dragging my little lead toys will be the farthest thing from my mind.

But since I am near New Zealand maybe I cold catch the All Blacks stomp sombody and see the Haka.

Irondog

irondog068 wrote:Well then fully plate armored knights being used as Crusaders should also not bother you than. Since my favorite armor is Gothic style plate. Much more "Mean" than Maximillian or silly old chain mail.

I mean after all this is what I like in a armored knight and it looks no more out of place to me than a 1600 Samurai playing in the Gempi war. But fear not DaiSho. I do not think we will ever cross tourny paths because if I ever make it to the "Land down under" Dragging my little lead toys will be the farthest thing from my mind.

But since I am near New Zealand maybe I cold catch the All Blacks stomp sombody and see the Haka.

Irondog

Gothic army is pretty win, but as someone has said all this is kind of defunct as you'll have Hittite fighting WotR Yorkists etc.

irondog068 wrote:Well then fully plate armored knights being used as Crusaders should also not bother you than. Since my favorite armor is Gothic style plate. Much more "Mean" than Maximillian or silly old chain mail.

I don't know what, about my posts, would indicate to you that I would care what figures you use. You could use Crusader Tanks for Crusader Knights or elephants dressed in Tutu's for all I care so long as I can easily tell which are Armoured Knights and which are Spearmen. That's pretty much the stance I've taken the whole thread.

Ian

Life is too short...

Take a big chill pill guys.

Well for Crusader tanks I sould use A9s in the canter scheme.


But on a modeling note, those of you who are planning to build your pre 1500 army and plan on using Old Glory for your Retainers (there were no Ashigaru until after 1500). There "Early Ashigaru" who I hoped would look more like retainers would be at home in 1600! There "Late Ashigaru" look like Samurai. The whole line (short of the Ninjas and female Samurai which are just well, odd) are way more 1570 than 1270.

So it looks like Essex for the Gempi war.

Irondog

Do we have a stifle button here?

Just givnig info before someone (like me) buys a bunch of "Late Ashigaru to finish my 15mm Samurai army (dosen't everyone have the same army in 2 sizes?) and finiding out they are well kind of Samurai looking. Plus the thought of a quick, creap "down and dirty" Gempi War army is out since the "Early Ashigaru" are well, late.

irondog068 wrote: But on a modeling note, those of you who are planning to build your pre 1500 army and plan on using Old Glory for your Retainers (there were no Ashigaru until after 1500). There "Early Ashigaru" who I hoped would look more like retainers would be at home in 1600! There "Late Ashigaru" look like Samurai. The whole line (short of the Ninjas and female Samurai which are just well, odd) are way more 1570 than 1270.

So it looks like Essex for the Gempi war.

Irondog

To be fair, Old Glory 15mm do list their figs under the name "Samurai (1530-1615)". So this is not a so much buyer beware but a buyer read the labels kind of thing. I like some of the range, but they are definitely focused on the period for DBR/FOGR.

Sorry, I missed that. I just went to the pictures. It does look like the line will flush out the 2 Dragons minis I got coming from my friend. He is getting Koreans, Samurai are to hard to paint. Little does he knows decals are my ace in the hole

Irondog

Minifigs and Naismith do/did very nice early Samurai, but the ranges are very dated now (both must be 20/25 years old).

irondog068 wrote:Sorry, I missed that. I just went to the pictures. It does look like the line will flush out the 2 Dragons minis I got coming from my friend. He is getting Koreans, Samurai are to hard to paint. Little does he knows decals are my ace in the hole

Irondog

I'm doing mine in 10mm. Been tossing and turning with how to paint them, but I think it will involve a lot of dark colours with a lot of lighter coloured dots in lines across the armour.

One thing I am thinking of doing (perhaps the entire army, although it will probably look wrong - maybe just a BG) is Ii Naomasa's Red Devils. Totally out of period, but think it would look good. (We've discussed our differings of opinions on ahistorical figures, so lets not go there.)


Ian

DaiSho wrote: One thing I am thinking of doing (perhaps the entire army, although it will probably look wrong - maybe just a BG) is Ii Naomasa's Red Devils. Totally out of period, but think it would look good.

I for one think using figures sold as representing the modern-day British Army Parachute display team, dubbing their words into Japanese and calling them Samurai probably oversteps the mark for us all here.

Well it would fit doing the "Red Devils" who's commander died in 1600.

madaxeman wrote: I for one think using figures sold as representing the modern-day British Army Parachute display team, dubbing their words into Japanese and calling them Samurai probably oversteps the mark for us all here.

It's that, or Elephants in Tutu's.

Ian

Painting Samurai in the peroid of the book is complex. They weaved metal in the big square armor plates into patterns of arrowheads or something else that was artistic to them. There exposed clothing also had patterns. My advice is to pick up one of Trumble's books. Retainers had that small silly black hat and black torso armor with diffrent color lace.

Look at Assault Groups Games Samurai line for how they looked in 28mm. I think they even have a painting guide.

For tips on the later peroid and how I painted my 300+ Perry figures go to the Ren list and look at Samuria I will be glad to help.

Irondog

I agree with Above
I saw some of the Old Glory 15 Samurai and they are great looking figures
Send Jay over there and email and he can tell you the details
Jay is a sharp young man and I have found him to be most helpful

I"m new to FoG having just gotten my rulebook and Empires of the Dragon. I specifically wanted to start with pre-1600 Japanese as my first army, Late Heian to Murumachi would have been great. I've read this thread, is it safe to say that there aren't any Japanese miniatures currently in production that are a perfect match (or really close) for the Empires of the Dragon lists? Essex has some under the heading "Samurai 950-1450 AD" but since my other Osprey books haven't arrived yet I don't have any pictures to match up the miniatures to. What's the consensus on those for FoG list accuracy?

I could fudge it and play later samurai but personally I would rather not.

Late Heian - Muromachi

I bought 2 Dragons with No Sashimono's
Lots of mixed figures foot and mounted for the Bushi units, sorry battlegroups.
I'm incapable of doing all the fiddly bits on the armour and at 15mm who cares!
In my opinion they painted well and look good at normal distance (no magnifying glass), so I'm happy.
Don't really care what belly button gazers think.