Slitherine

I think you are over estimating the Axis at this point....dont think they will win this, almost a whole year left, about 17 turns left of the game....think that is more than enough to demolish the axis. 5-6 turns more and the Axis will start crumbling and the outcome will be more obvious

Think it has been an exiting game though, fun to follow

Crazygunner1 wrote:I think you are over estimating the Axis at this point....dont think they will win this, almost a whole year left, about 17 turns left of the game....think that is more than enough to demolish the axis. 5-6 turns more and the Axis will start crumbling and the outcome will be more obvious

Think it has been an exiting game though, fun to follow

yes, 17 turns is really long for Axis to hold !

Crazygunner1 wrote:I think you are over estimating the Axis at this point....dont think they will win this, almost a whole year left, about 17 turns left of the game....think that is more than enough to demolish the axis. 5-6 turns more and the Axis will start crumbling and the outcome will be more obvious

I don't agree. Even without air support Soviet will still need a lot of time to break through Western Poland into Germany. Those fortresses there are a hard nut if manned properly. If Germans manage to keep them till bad weather hits then Allies have very little clear turns for making long reaching moves.

All depends what Allies will be able to do. Morris didn't destroy much of Americans and they are the hardest to rebuild. But for me they should be able to liberate Holland only before the game ends.

I'm also interested how it will end.

Kragdob wrote:

Crazygunner1 wrote:I think you are over estimating the Axis at this point....dont think they will win this, almost a whole year left, about 17 turns left of the game....think that is more than enough to demolish the axis. 5-6 turns more and the Axis will start crumbling and the outcome will be more obvious

I don't agree. Even without air support Soviet will still need a lot of time to break through Western Poland into Germany. Those fortresses there are a hard nut if manned properly. If Germans manage to keep them till bad weather hits then Allies have very little clear turns for making long reaching moves.

All depends what Allies will be able to do. Morris didn't destroy much of Americans and they are the hardest to rebuild. But for me they should be able to liberate Holland only before the game ends.

I'm also interested how it will end.

There is a bad news for Axis , we found the LVL of USSR STR is 11( top dogfight data). so it is really hard to say what will be the final result !

Morris wrote:it is really hard to say what will be the final result !

It is my bet. I am just a human so I can be all wrong

Kragdob wrote:

Morris wrote:it is really hard to say what will be the final result !

It is my bet. I am just a human so I can be all wrong

Excuse me , what is your bet ? I did not find it in your comment .

July 16th 1944 fair

We continue our retreat from the west front .I think they will come after me later . But we can not find it in this turn .

In the east , situation comes serious . they move a little bit forward & kill another 3 INFs . We really wonder whether we can fix the breakthrough . But however the Luftwaffe come back from the west . we will count on their performance next turn .

In Italy , allies come around Miland .


before moves :


west front :






east front :







Italy :








after moves :

I still think you will easily win this. Time is running out for Joe. Only 3 guaranteed fair weather turns if I counted correctly after this turn in this year. If you manage to hold the eastern front at the current perimeter until weather turns bad, you will win. Only if you got really bad luck with the weather (fair weather until November, mostly winter weather turns and renewed fair weather in February), Joe will have chance to win this and even then it will be hard for the Allies.

But beware of any amphibious landings, I think this will be the only chance for Joe to strike at the heart of Germany in due time. Your bombers should be ready to bomb the Allied transports to hell. If you have still some German naval units left, even if badly damaged, move them to the Baltics to strike at any Soviet transport. In one of my recent games even a 1 step German BB was able to inflict serious damage to 10 step Soviet transports (six steps or even more) in 1944/45, as their naval techs are so bad.

The other wild card in this game are the Allied para units. They could lead to some suprises, so be careful about them.

Remember that the Russians fight at full strength during the winter. So Morris needs mud. Russia needs to kill Axis units to make a hole they can ooze through. Morris doesn't have more room in the east to trade.

I think Berlin will fall, but Joe must reach Hamburg too. I think it's a mistake to not pursue the Germans in France. That allows the panzer to go back in the reserve. If the panzers are placed near Hamburg then they can kill any naval or para landings nearby. I guess the German attack scared the US so much so Morris can hold the west to the winter.

I also don't see major bombing of German cities. It's too late to start now, but keeping the German production down is vital.

I think Morris can now win this game if he plays a delaying game around Berlin and uses his reserves around Hamburg. Joe needs to land in 1944 and secure a port to have a chance. Copenhagen is one possibility. Soon this window of opportunity closes.

I think this game is proof the victory conditions work. Strategically the Axis will lose the war, but they might still win the game

zechi wrote:I still think you will easily win this. Time is running out for Joe. Only 3 guaranteed fair weather turns if I counted correctly after this turn in this year. If you manage to hold the eastern front at the current perimeter until weather turns bad, you will win. Only if you got really bad luck with the weather (fair weather until November, mostly winter weather turns and renewed fair weather in February), Joe will have chance to win this and even then it will be hard for the Allies.

But beware of any amphibious landings, I think this will be the only chance for Joe to strike at the heart of Germany in due time. Your bombers should be ready to bomb the Allied transports to hell. If you have still some German naval units left, even if badly damaged, move them to the Baltics to strike at any Soviet transport. In one of my recent games even a 1 step German BB was able to inflict serious damage to 10 step Soviet transports (six steps or even more) in 1944/45, as their naval techs are so bad.

The other wild card in this game are the Allied para units. They could lead to some suprises, so be careful about them.

Thanks for your support , but I really can not be optimistic as you . Since I do know the present situation of Axis is not good . The Ecnomic of Germany is broken & is getting worse everyturn . We have no pp to repair our Luftwaffe after terrible dogfight against USSR's top LVL FTR . So we will soon lose the airsupport at all . & then the whole Germany troops will have to fight with their blood to against allies steel . It looks hopeless. But we will fight to the last minutes .

Stauffenberg wrote:but keeping the German production down is vital.

You are quite right sir ! I have no pp to repair my FTRS ! If someday the game allow units(especially the airforce) to be reorginized , Germany will have hope !

Aug 6th 1944 fair

In the west , The allies troops appears from the war fog east from Rennes including US arm, we sacrify a tac to find out how big is the new group . It seems nothing could stop them to take Paris this turn . there are still 2 fair turn at least .They will move into Germany before winter .

In the east , breakthrough again , we counter attack to take two key position back ,but we can do nothing to the other lost positions . Also Luftwaffe take terrible tough fight against Ussr ftrs ! They are all at dogfight lvl 9 !! I believe Joe open the first USSR lab on air ! He is so farsighted !

In Italy , Allies will attack Miland & Vinice .


screenshot before move :

west front :







east front :








after moves :

Looks good for Morris. I think he'll hold both Hamburg and Berlin with any good fortune from weather. But, the Axis will be crushed, though Morris will win.

Schnurri wrote:Looks good for Morris. I think he'll hold both Hamburg and Berlin with any good fortune from weather. But, the Axis will be crushed, though Morris will win.

Yes , Axis will be crushed & Morris is difficult to win . Maybe back the Manstein's words : the best result for Axis is a draw !

Stauffenberg wrote:I think Berlin will fall, but Joe must reach Hamburg too.

But, is this right? If Allies take Berlin, Rome, & Paris, they win, no?

Diplomaticus wrote:

Stauffenberg wrote:I think Berlin will fall, but Joe must reach Hamburg too.

But, is this right? If Allies take Berlin, Rome, & Paris, they win, no?

No , Allies have to take Humburg ! It is second Germany capital .

Do they have to take Rome?

The Allies win if both Italy and Germany have surrendered. If one of the countries are alive after May 1945 then the Axis win. The number of major power primary capitals they still control determines the Axis victory level. So Rome is only important if Morris wins. Italy has already surrendered

Aug 26 th 1944 fair


In the west , Allies finally took Paris .& whether they will move into Germany in 1944 is all depends on weather !

In the east , The luftwaffe did a final fight against Russians top FTRs without any supply ( I have no pp to repair them ). Soviet kill two more INFs & one Mech & move forward one more hex .

In Italy ,Allies troops move forward to Alpes .

Generally , Whether Axis could be hold to 1945 or even a little chance to win does all depends on the weather of the turn of Oct 4th 1944 & Oct 24th 1944 .
If all fair , Axis will lose . If all bad Axis will have opportunity to seek for a draw . If one of them is fair Axis will be over in early 1945 . It is so historic !

But just because of the above situation , it appears the perfect game engine of this game !


before moves :


west front :







east front :









Italy front :








Since I almost did nothing attack , so I quit the screen shot after moves .

Morris wrote:Aug 26 th 1944 fair


In the west , Allies finally took Paris .

Historically, the occupying German garrison in Paris surrendered on 25 August 1944. You guys are 1-day off.