Slitherine

Cronos09 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 11:45 am you can only mount/dismount your dragoon unit once at the beginning of the turn and then it can be moved based on its AP. There is no AP partition.

So you can't shoot as dismounted dragoons, mount and run as mounted Horses ?
Dismount/Mount is the first decision you take during a turn (before moving and/or shooting) ?
Nice!!!

Athos1660 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 12:02 pm Dismount/Mount is the first decision you take during a turn (before moving and/or shooting) ?

Yes. You can send me the module in which you would like to add these dragoons. And mark in SQUADS.csv 2 models for the convertion. I will add them in it.

Thanks, Cronos !

Great mechanism (nicely adapted from FoG2).

Here is the progress of my testing for Dragoons (for the first 3/4 of the 17th century?) :

1) Mounted Dragoons

For now, I made Dragoons pure infantry on horseback, unable to shoot when mounted. And that lasts during the entire turn according to this mechanism (which is quite a disadvantage for a unit on the battlefield!). To balance them with the Light foot (such as the Detached Musketeers), I gave them Hussars' AP (20), making them able to move forward 5 squares while LF can move 3 square (and... shoot! during the same turn). Maybe it does not take enough into account the fact that, certainly, Hussars and such had better horses and were better horsemen, but AP=16 wouldn't give Dragoons a significant advantage compared to the LF.

30-50% Musket could be added to the Mounted Dragoons later, making some of them able to shoot on horseback.



2) Dismounted Dragoons

This is Vanilla Dragoons with only AP = 12 (instead of 16), that is the same amount of APs as LF.
12 APs (instead of the planned 10) enable dismounted Dragoons to evade.



I tried to balance LF and these Dragoons. That way, the dragoons can quickly move deep inside the enemy zone. When a too strong enemy force comes near the Dragoons, they can prefer to mount and flee without shooting.

I must admit I don't know yet if these Dragoons are of any interest/fun, compared to the Vanilla ones.
I must play more with them to know...

Any suggestions anyway ?

I turned the Dismounted Dragoons into Detached Musketeers to have them behave as Light foot which is quite historical/logical.



So that :

• in rough terrain, mounted Dragoons are Moderately disordered and dismounted Dragoons are Steady while Vanilla Dragoons are Steady

• in difficult terrain, mounted Dragoons are Severely disordered and dismounted Dragoons are Steady while Vanilla Dragoons are Moderately disordered

I did a few changes :

1) Dismounted Dragoons
= Detached Musketeers with only AP=10.

• AP = 10 (don’t let enemy cavalry come close to your dismounted Dragoons (within 2 squares) unless you want them to attack either your soldiers on the run to their horses or your unprotected waiting horses and their few servants, as AP=10 reduces their evasion capability against Cavalry. Moreover, dismounted Dragoons might have less mobility than Light foot as they may have to stay near their horses ?)

• Type : Light_Foot

• IconID (pic) : Dragoons

• AssetFileName (3D model) : Dragoons

• Musket 33% (only 83 men out of 250 able to shoot

2) Mounted Dragoons

• AP = 20 (must be faster than non-light cavalry and their AP=16)

• Type : Dragoons

• IconID : Dragoons

• AssetFileName : MountedArquebusiers (=Light horse)

• Musket 33% (only 83 men out of 250 able to shoot with a matchlock musket when mounted, casualties are quite 'cosmetic')

3) I still have an issue with the type of my mounted Dragoons. I would like them to be like Vanilla Dragoons when fighting but with the same 'terrain behavior' as the Vanilla Light Horse, that is :

• Like Vanilla Dragoons, they shouldn’t be able to charge unfragmented non-light troops (other than artillery) in open terrain, even in flank or rear.

• Unlike Vanilla Light horse, they shouldn’t have the +100 Impact PoAs of any mounted against any light foot (…) warriors or unprotected commanded shot or medium foot without bayonet.

• Like Vanilla Light horse :
  • in rough terrain, they should be Moderately disordered and not Steady like the Vanilla Dragoons,
  • in difficult terrain (Woods and Marsh), they should be severely disordered and not only Moderately disordered like the Vanilla Dragoons
  
  (edit)
  Musket%, APs and AssetFileName

A big thank you to Cronos, a very talented and helpful modder!





(updated)

It could be nice if mounting and dismounting (or embark and disembark for landing) cost a certain amount of APs to simulate the time wasted in doing so.

(edit)

For example, with AP(mount)=20 and AP(dismount)=10 :

• turn 2 : the dismounted dragoons mount. Mounting costs say 4 APs. Mounted dragoons can move 20-4=16 APs this turn.

• turn 3 : the mounted dragoons move. They can use 20 APs.

• turn 4 : the dragoons dismount. Dismounting costs say 2 APs (1). The dismounted dragoons can use 10-2=8 APs this turn, then 10.

_____
(1) or the same amount of APs as mounting.

(...not to mention a small area of the battlefield where it could only be done : to mount/embark, I have to go where I previously dismounted/disembarked )

As there's a bug in my previous concept of mouting/dismounting dragoons (after mounting they could not charge during that turn), I use a new one:

- during turn 1, you can move as a horse, dismount and can only shoot;
- during turn 2, you can move as foot, shoot and mount.

That is, after conversion, you cannot move the unit till next turn (except shooting as foot)

Cronos09 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:33 pm

Athos1660 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:06 am I'd like to know :
1) your opinion about an idea of mine about dragoons,
2) and whether or not it is moddable.

1) not a bad idea;
2) moddable:


https://yadi.sk/d/ow_zFzUuYgwirg unzip the archive and paste in your module. If there are files with the same names in it, you should take the necessary strings from them. Probably, it should be tested more.

Hi,

Did you manage to get your Dragoons mod to work ? because again - using the Cotes Bridge scenario as an example,
I see no change ( after modding it with the Dragoons mod ) that is no option to mount my Dragoons, at the start of
my turn and therefore they continue to move & fire much as before ( with the dismounted dragoons image throughout )
with no option to mount their horses.

JohnWise wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 10:34 pm

Cronos09 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:33 pm

Athos1660 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:06 am I'd like to know :
1) your opinion about an idea of mine about dragoons,
2) and whether or not it is moddable.

1) not a bad idea;
2) moddable:

https://yadi.sk/d/ow_zFzUuYgwirg unzip the archive and paste in your module. If there are files with the same names in it, you should take the necessary strings from them. Probably, it should be tested more.

Hi,

Did you manage to get your Dragoons mod to work ? because again - using the Cotes Bridge scenario as an example,
I see no change ( after modding it with the Dragoons mod ) that is no option to mount my Dragoons, at the start of
my turn and therefore they continue to move & fire much as before ( with the dismounted dragoons image throughout )
with no option to mount their horses.

This was an experimental mod for Athos so that he saw the implementation of his ideas about Dragoons. Moreover, there was no option of Mounting/Dismounting for Dragoons there.