Slitherine

braccada wrote:I think there are more enemies, too. I noticed that in the Caucasus where a lot of Soviet tanks are missing and often there are more enemy planes. For me the most difficult missions were Malta and Gazala. Persia and Caucasus could be a pain especially playing the Italian challenge. Other than that I think there are no real obstacles even on Rommel. Maybe India. I have not played that, but I do not nearly have enough prestige for a best case core or even enough units.

All things considered in my opinion Rommel is as more difficult in the Wehrmacht campaign. I feel I had more prestige issues there. However Afrika Corps is not easy and I am sure most people can't do the Italian Challenge on Rommel. So great work!

Well, and your comment made me laugh, so do not worry, you are definitely good at writing

That said

Maybe more enemies too.

I can't say anything relevant here just that even without changing difficulty Levels the subsequent Patches of the Game change things too.

e.g. Caucasus for sure is a constant struggle to weed through the mountains in the center and the Tanks in the North, with a little Sideshow in the South to start with. But watching your Caucasus video I saw that you had to conquer Sotschi for a Decisive Victory. Dunno what has changed resp when it changed but in my last playthrough (with Patch 1.30 installed) Sotschi is now not a Prime Target anymore, instead the most Western Flag in the Mountains is. I played through Afrika Korps at least once on Colonel before and then again in my Original Italian Challenge Attempt on Colonel and can not remember any little detail. But here in this Scenario I had this feeling something is different (not that each patch or new attempt on a Campaign makes Gameplay a little bit different in the First place) But I struggled with hordes of Troops in the Mountains and I struggled with hordes of Tanks in the North (Struggling as in costly losses and expensive Replacements) so no need conquer Sotschi but just enter Makop and the Victory Hex in the Mountains (on which I dropped an Italian Alpini via Air Transport) was a relevation. Conquering Sotschi with time running out and already beaten up Units could have been costly to avoid the term bloodbath

I'm surprised you think Malta is that hard. I'm certainly not in a positon to tell you you how to do it, but me thinketh you are playing Afrika Korps for the First Time in a blind playthrough and there are a few scenarios where it is essential to know when you are better off leaving certain kind of stuff alone (Just as you did in Persia). Hard to spot that on a first maybe on a second Run as well
The Arty Bunker on the Island in the Middle is such a case. It has a range of just 3 and certainly controls the path between both islands, but can only hurt your ground troops when you enter the both city hexes on the islands( and only the one in the South is a Victory Hex (probably late in the scenario, if not on the last turn). Don't waste valauable shots on that thing instead level bomb the Britisch Fleet and move your own Fleet (or at least most of it) to the South asap and attack the southern Victory Hex and a few other things while on your way south. The British Fleet is toast pretty soon and then the Arty Bunker sits there pretty useless as it can not attack anything if you are careful.

You can even deploy your ground troops a round or 2 late and eliminate Destroyers and Fighters attacking in this area first. Way more convenient and less random what reaches Malta in useable Condition

Persia is a nightmare though
Tough Start with the Russian units and heavy Air attacks, but thats not the real problem. The real problem are thes damn convoy trucks and to get in a position to stop them. And then once you think hey now it gets a little more relaxing they surprisingly try to land troops from offshore in the North.
If in the correct position by then and with enough stuff in the area all tasks not to hard to do you can even harvest lotsa Prestige letting them deploy in prepared areas, but if you are caught by surprise they will at least hurt you a lot.

Wow long post again and the egg tries to teach the chicken, I better try to be more humble, maybe you spoiled me with your freindly Pep Talk already

Anyway India is certainly a very hard scenario and i'm shit scared that I will run out of gas there as i can see that I will be too short on Prestige then to acquire a Tiger 2 then, let alone a few of them. t'was hard enough with the Prestige I gathered on Colonel now with approx half of it it will be harder than ever. I'm pretty confident to reach it though as I just need 3 Minor Victories to do so.
Thinking about "tanking" for minor victories in the remaining Buildup Scenarios as an alternative to preserve Prestige for it already. Dunno if that can work out, at least never done it before

I've never got beyond Suez doing standard AK Italian challenge, but I have managed to complete Nikki's Italian variant of AK at Colonel level.

Doing the standard AK version is definitely tougher since inexperienced Italian units are facing against mostly better equipment, and if playing at FM (or higher) the slower experience gain would only make this worse. However, the Italian variant of AK provides a good opportunity to learn how the Italian units work for less determined or less experienced players.

The extra early scenarios in Nikki's variant give enough experience (and with luck some useful heroes) to provide a decent chance. I was also using equipment file 16, which provides a slightly better 47mm AT gun (HA8 instead of 6) and the ability to use Somua S35. These do help, but I think that playing US Corps had provided me with an understanding of how to use under-armoured tanks (scout well and only attack soft targets). In India itself, the abundant close terrain favours infantry and artillery so heroes and experience count for a lot, and the panthers, captured tanks and SE units are good enough. The primary advantage is that most of the Italian units are relatively cheap, so you can afford in-game elite reinforcements when needed and in the desert scenarios, the trucks are no worse than half tracks.

I on the other found Persia quite easy Malta was the only map where I really felt some serious time pressure. Would not be as much of a problem and a second run. If you know the map you can destroy the enemy airforce before it can do damage and knowing size and location of the enemy fleet is very important. That is why I destroyed the fortress on the island. I had to limit the enemy vision, because I could not simply go past it right into an unknown fleet presence. I was less worried about the damage.

braccada wrote:I on the other found Persia quite easy Malta was the only map where I really felt some serious time pressure. Would not be as much of a problem and a second run. If you know the map you can destroy the enemy airforce before it can do damage and knowing size and location of the enemy fleet is very important. That is why I destroyed the fortress on the island. I had to limit the enemy vision, because I could not simply go past it right into an unknown fleet presence. I was less worried about the damage.

Ah Vision yeah another Part of the Game I often bluntly neglect and I learned a lot about from your videos.
I definintely suck in that regard. I do not really care about it and even if I do from time to time I struggle with it just as with magnifficent Traps especially in the Air you set.

Well I don't really have an excuse for that, except that I have some serious roots in Games C&C Generals Zero Hour (especially the Challenge Mode) and starcraft 2. Both games have in common that you have to fight each scenario as it is and just win it somehow but no real core building Process like Panter Corps. And a certified Tank rush is always a viable tactic there if you have the Units available

As long as I am at that point I probably play with the Mantra " They can see me, so they can fear me !"

I'm pretty sure better I see it as proven Knowledge that you would do better on a second run. Maybe my idea how to do an AAR will basically generate some interest as I in fact played the Afrika Corps on 2 different locations and 2 differnt computers a few days resp weeks apart and with the urge to just make it it the First Run on Rommel and the idea to try something different a few days later and still very fresh memories what to expect
Still there are so many intangibles in this game (and thats a huge part I love it so much) that a little weather change, a different hero or an unlucky result can change a scenario a lot. So much that a new run is again very rewarding to avoid the term thrilling.
Thats in a way a huge part of my Panzer Corps experience. Even if i get the feeling i have seen everything before then there is a new patch that changes little things, a twist of the weather and so on and somehow everything has that kind of shiny new touch.

I at least abandoned 3 or 4 Grand Campaigns half way through in 43 as there was a new Patch a new DLC a Seelion, Soviet wahtever Allied Corps or GC and curious as I am I sit there drooling to conquer the new Toys and Maps. Well and if you are away from a GC for some time you lose the feel and love for my units and feel the urge to start anything from scratch

haha yeah before I started to do the lets plays I could not help starting games over and over again just because I discovered a new trick that of course would change everything or a new patch or whatever. Overdoing this really takes the fun out of it.

So I often abondoned games and did not come back for a long time. And like you said once you lose touch with a campaign or units it is worthless and well you have to start all over again

Just finished the Italian Challenge on General with a decisive victory in India. It was not as difficult as I had anticipated, largely because I was able to field mostly German armor, even without purchasing any. The biggest difference was the need to field exclusively Italian infantry. (The initial two German units became my engineers.) I remembered from my "regular" playthrough that the Sahariana were the best Italian infantry until the '43 Bersaglieri appeared, so as soon as the Sahariana became available I parked all of the Bersaglieri in the reserve pool and fielded all of the Sahariana I could manage. I recalled the Bersaglieri in the Caucasus as Alpini, and the upgraded them to '43 Bersaglieri. I found that it took two Italian infantry to accomplish what one German unit could have done, so I fielded more infantry than I would have in a regular playthrough.

The Italian strategic bombers are awesome: devastating and tough as nails. The Italian fighters are adequate until the Tempest shows up. The only "policy change" I would make if I did this again would be to disband any SE tac bombers and wait for SE fighters. Two SE tanks were enough.

This was a lot of fun--I strongly recommend it.

I'll second your recommendation, these Italian Units have some serious underdog Charme.

It is definitely possible to go to India on Rommel in Italian Style (perhaps even without losing a single Unit along the way), but for a Run oft the Mill Player like me certainly not in any way resembling a blind playthrough, that kind of task is more fitting for braccada Level players. Since we cant erase braccadas Memory we will never know for sure ;p.

So goose with his superhuman skills is now the guy I'm lobbying for to make a Run for it.
But his aggressive style in combination with the Spezial Afrika Corps Flavour + blind Playthrough + Italian Units sound like an explosive and extremely bloody Campaign

hurly wrote:I'll second your recommendation, these Italian Units have some serious underdog Charme.

It is definitely possible to go to India on Rommel in Italian Style (perhaps even without losing a single Unit along the way), but for a Run oft the Mill Player like me certainly not in any way resembling a blind playthrough, that kind of task is more fitting for braccada Level players. Since we cant erase braccadas Memory we will never know for sure ;p.

So goose with his superhuman skills is now the guy I'm lobbying for to make a Run for it.
But his aggressive style in combination with the Spezial Afrika Corps Flavour + blind Playthrough + Italian Units sound like an explosive and extremely bloody Campaign

Thanks for the vote of confidence? I think?

I will be attempting sometime starting around the beginning of 2017 and plan on doing my day by day reports like here:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 45&t=65111

But I will try and stay on top of my reports with greater frequency as I am still in 1944 with my reports but am deep in 1945 with my actual playthrough. I now have had 2 Marginal Victories the first being in 1943 at Oboyan and the 2nd in 1945. Any guesses which scenario?

It was brutal and I might have been able to get a Decisive Victory I was just unwilling to take that many costly casualties in order to get it.

Thanks for the encouragement, this is such a great community.

goose_2 wrote:

hurly wrote:I'll second your recommendation, these Italian Units have some serious underdog Charme.

It is definitely possible to go to India on Rommel in Italian Style (perhaps even without losing a single Unit along the way), but for a Run oft the Mill Player like me certainly not in any way resembling a blind playthrough, that kind of task is more fitting for braccada Level players. Since we cant erase braccadas Memory we will never know for sure ;p.

So goose with his superhuman skills is now the guy I'm lobbying for to make a Run for it.
But his aggressive style in combination with the Spezial Afrika Corps Flavour + blind Playthrough + Italian Units sound like an explosive and extremely bloody Campaign

Thanks for the vote of confidence? I think?

It is a vote of confidence.

With a few IF's tough.

I just have this little multiplayer sample of 2 multiplayer battles which is quite small.
Then according to your posts you have neither played Allied Corps, Allied GC nor Afrika Corps (especially Not with emphasis on Italian Units) before, so most likely there is a learning process involved.
The biggest difference I would Single out is the inferior quality of Tanks most of the time.
You just can not at any time go head to head with a Sherman or Italian Tank Vs any healthy German (Allied for Italians) counterpart (I have yet to see them One shot anyone like Tiger or Tiger 2 Do quite often)

I'm quite aggressive myself and take Risks from time to time some cause I lack in discipline or concentration or cause I just want to finish this “already solved“ Level and eager to See the next task.

In short All These things cost me lots of experience or Prestige maybe both.

From a distant point of view I would say braccadas careful approach with lots of extra prestige harvested via surrender ist more suited for a blind playthrough on Rommel (half the Prestige) and getting used to some new units that came with a few gems and several disappointing performers. Not sure how much margin of error there is in terms of burned Prestige.

But braccada is Not eligible for a blind Italian Challenge anymore so my appeal to you is:
If you ever consider going BLIND all the way to India on Rommel, do it Italian Style First.
Thats Not cause I want to see you fail, quite the opposite I would like to See, how an Elite Player adjusts to all this and finds a way.

I will certainly stand at the sidelines and cheer for you, wiggle the pompoms or refill the water bottles , whatever helps

Heh, heh. Thanks for the laugh. Very Funny, love the accolades