Slitherine

captainjack wrote: And I've had +1 spotting on Ronsdorf, who has +2 to start with. Who needs recon when you have a Panzer IVG with 5 spotting?

A tank that spots 5 in the desert, yeah that would totally eliminate the need for recon.

captainjack wrote:And I've had +1 spotting on Ronsdorf, who has +2 to start with. Who needs recon when you have a Panzer IVG with 5 spotting?

I didn't think the AI allowed you to "stack" spotting heroes because I don't think I've ever seen it. Might as well turn "Fog of War" off. Well done!

The 5 spotting Ronsdorf was in Europe and even with the +2 spotting hero he comes with I can manage quite well without recon if I plan moves with a bit of care (if I get an infantry spotting hero I will often convert it to kradschutzen to cover the other half of the map).

In the desert I once had 2 spotting heroes on a Panzer IVG, and there's no reason why you couldn't have two spotting heroes on Ronsdorf to give a total spotting of 6 - that's some serious binoculars, even allowing for high quality German and Swiss optics!

However, even with an all-seeing Ronsdorf, recon move is still useful for locating mines.

I am doing my Blind playthrough of Naval Crete.
Good Grief!!
Some of my precious units got tagged and bagged on the beach.
Thanks for the suggestion of improving my recon Rudel.
Next scenario I am looking forward to super Rudel and still waiting for a multiple hero unit.

I just got Super Rudel.
He is awesome.
Still waiting for a multiple hero.

From the Hero Trigger Mechanics thread there was an entry by ThvN. Heroes are partially a function of kills & it went like this...

1st hero: 100-300
2nd hero: 301-1000
3rd hero: 1001-2000

In my experience that seems about right for the first 1-2 heroes. I think the 3rd hero can come to a unit with less than 1000 kills... Don't have too many of those units myself so I'd have to check. They start arriving in late 43/44. You can search out the thread if you're interested. My guess is that if you're in Barbarossa, you'll be seeing a few 2-hero units soon.

TSPC37730 wrote:From the Hero Trigger Mechanics thread there was an entry by ThvN. Heroes are partially a function of kills & it went like this...

1st hero: 100-300
2nd hero: 301-1000
3rd hero: 1001-2000

In my experience that seems about right for the first 1-2 heroes. I think the 3rd hero can come to a unit with less than 1000 kills... Don't have too many of those units myself so I'd have to check. They start arriving in late 43/44. You can search out the thread if you're interested. My guess is that if you're in Barbarossa, you'll be seeing a few 2-hero units soon.

Thanks for the feedback that was very helpful.
The depth of this game is something I just literally savor.

Taking my lunch to give an update on Blind playthrough on Field Marshall difficulty on the Grand Campaign.

AAAaaaaarrrrrgggggghhhhhhh!!!!!

I lost a couple of good Units that really makes me mad.
It was on the Smolensk battle and it was for the same reason that I always lose units.
Trying to be too darn aggressive. My rushing always costs me.
When will I learn.
One was one of my nice Engineer units that I had pretty stacked. (Darn those T34's can hit hard when I have them in a transport.)
The second is the one I am so upset about.
It was the tank that I got the 2nd round in the game in a PZ 2c with an outstanding leader. I should have used it as a mop up unit until I could put him in a proper tank for the campaign, but no Frontlines and they through everything at him until he finally just blew up.
Bummer!

I guess that is what makes a blind playthrough so challenging.
At least I didn't have long to get attached that new unit, but I am still mad.
Ok thanks for letting me vent.
Still waiting for first multiplayer unit.

Taking my lunch to give an update on Blind playthrough on Field Marshall Difficulty on the Grand Campaign.

I lost another unit. Getting greedy again. Never never never put your transports at the head of your advance. Never.

You are taking ground plenty quick when you take over everything on the map with 4 turns to spare. It is ok to slow down.

My Super Rudel Bomber is dominating.
He can almost one shot anything that is not entrenched on a sunny day, which is fun.

I am just starting Novgorod and can almost feel that 2nd hero on 1 unit, but not quite there yet.
I am hopeful but finding it difficult to find time to play the single player campaign since I am playing so many players in the multiplayer.

Rudel is indeed awesome. If you're going to overstrength anything, you should start with Rudel (I usually don't overstrength too many units, save for AA & artillery). About the only thing that can rain on your parade is an 85mm AA gun or one of those annoying T-90s. Oh, and of course, rain.

Taking my lunch to give an update on my progress.

It pleases me that some people apparently find this thread interesting. I wish I could up one of those cool let's play thingy's on youtube, but sadly I am technologically challenged.

I lost one of my Panzer Jager anti tank units. In Novgorod, Bummer.
At least it wasn't for doing something dumb, it was from a fierce counter attack that overwhelmed the unit.
I have finished the scenario with DV and am now starting Leningrad. I have just elite replaced all my lost units and replaced the lost anti tank gun. I have almost 2000 in leftover prestige before I start the new scenario and I have a couple questions before I get started that will help guide me without ruining the blind let's play I am trying to do.

I have many more units than I have slots to place. I have been working since I did not do very well in the 1939 campaign to supply myself with additional units to build up replacements that have experience to bring into later battles as I lose important units. This seems like a smart strategy to countermand the years where the Soviets come back on me full force. Ok so this brings me to me first question.

1st question:
I have this extra prestige and i usually spend a good amount overstrengthening units to bring into the battle I am playing. Is this not wise and a waste of prestige?

2nd question:
I have 4 SE units and one is maxed out in his experience. I try to place him in the back and only use him to mop up units because he just dominates with a 13 strength and 375 experience. Since he is maxed out should I not even bring him into play? Like either leave him way behind and only bring him up if I am in trouble or maybe leave him off the map entirely? I am conflicted because I think this is going to be my first unit to get a multiple hero if any of them can.

Let me know your thoughts.
Thanks for everone who is reading.

I have a BF110G with a +1 Attack and +6 Initiative in 42

goose_2 wrote:Let me know your thoughts.

These are my prestige saving tricks. Many other people have good ideas as well, and there's a whole thread (maybe two) on this including some discussion on when and whether to buy your infantry transport or to keep them fit by making them walk everywhere. I'm pretty sure I have avoided including spoilers, except what you could find by using Control+L after combats.

If playing under 1.2 rules, overstrength is expensive, especially if you use more than 11 or 12 strength. If you take a hit, the first points you lose are the most expensive to restore. If prestige is short you can have a lot more 11 strengths than 12 strengths. Personally I very rarely use overstrength above 12 even if I have prestige to spare as I'd rather use it on an emergency in-game elite reinforcement to save a key unit and preserve experience.Overstrengthing units with very good defence (eg +3 hero) means you are less likely to lose the expensive extra point or two. However, strategic bombers are more effective with overstrength, so if you have a strong fighter force and enough scouting to find the AA guns this can be useful. It can even be worth disbanding or downgrading the transport provided with the special SE infantry units to a normal halftrack because it makes replacements and overstrength cheaper, but this depends on your play style and how well you use fast units.

Between scenarios, normal reinforcement is free. Often if you are at 9 strength (and maybe at you can reinforce to 10 for nothing while still keeping your experience at the current level. For units like artillery that gain experience quite quickly, you can often afford to drop just below the current experience level as you will probably be back at 3* after the first combat.

Some units (eg heavier artillery) have a rate of fire <100%. At 80% RoF,a 15cm or 17cm gun going from 10 to 11 gives you 8 shots per attack to 8.8 shots, which is rounded down to 8. Keep it at 10 strength, upgrade to 12 rather than 11, or stick with the 10.5cm which has 100% Rof, so 1 extra attack per strength. At some point you may find the need to upgrade to heavier guns to suppress better armoured tanks. Heavier guns also have less ammo, so may spend less time firing and more reloading. In terms of bang for your prestige, the extra RoF and time in action probably favours the lighter guns more than most people expect.

Recon (and bridge engineers) usually work just as well with no experience. Don't use elite reinforcements or disband between scenarios and buy only when needed.

The SE units don't take a deployment slot, so you might as well keep playing them. Your 3* unit will fight well and have better all round survivability than an inexperienced unit. It is possible to disband SE units between scenarios for extra prestige, but as there is no guarantee when you will get a replacement you could lose a unit for several scenarios, and you will also lose the experience.

As for AT, your rueful comment suggests you are well aware that once they get a bit of experience they are very good against the heavier soviet tanks. Bringing in a green one at the stage you are at can take a bit of careful management to keep it alive, but they are cheap to reinforce. Self propelled seem to be a much better buy than towed ones. However, upgrade paths, (as with all units) are worth considering and may influence your choice of when you get that extra one.

Good luck!

Thanks captainjack for the wonderful and thought provoking information.

Let me first start off with hope everyone is geared up for a great Holy Week and a wonderful Easter. I for one really enjoyed our Maundy Thursday service last night and am looking forward to our Good Friday service tonight. My kids will be singing the Hymn "Were You There" chills people chills

Man the hints people have been dropping about the later years on the Grand Campaign have me shaking in my boots. I am not looking forward to the oncoming onslaught coming down the pike.

Let me give you a little more background on what happened early on in my campaign and how it has changed the way I play. So in the 1939 campaign when you have to hold all of those bridge points and the AI just sends wave after wave of counter attack I got kind of decimated because I do not like playing defense and went on the offense and paid the price for my aggressiveness. (I am not saying you cannot be aggressive on that scenario, i am saying that I did it blind and was surprised by the overwhelming forces thrown at me.)

Based on that scenario I started building back up my units and started adding additional units so if i lost a unit I would have other experienced units to replace them with. This has given me a pretty strong army going into 1941 with lots of fighters bombers and infantry extra units. (I have not been as successful with my tank and anti tank units. They seem a little vulnerable for my aggressive play style.) I have never been able to accumulate lots of prestige, but i am ok with that because I am trying to build up an impressive force. I know i will regret that when it comes time to upgrade, but i will cross that bridge when I get to it.

I typically overstrength units until I bring my prestige down to around 1000 into the new scenario and place all units that I am trying to build up experience on. (This is why I do not think I have been able to get a multiple hero unit yet...hence the origination of this thread.) Once I have a unit around 300 in experience I leave them behind and start buying new units to start getting experience in.

I am not sure how this strategy will pan out and I really really wanted to restart my 1939 campaign when I was in France in 1940 so I could start off with a stronger force but I decided I can only play a blind playthrough all the way through once and if I lose at the Field Marshall level my first time through then that should be what should happen. Otherwise the game would be to easy. I do not refight rounds or anything like that. If I lose a unit I get mad but I do not give up or retry it because that adds to the authenticity.

I love the suggestion of letting my infantry hoof it to cut down on replacement costs. That is a suggestion I plan on immediately implementing for any additional infantry units I buy.

I have 4 infantry se units.
Should I disband one of the less experienced se units and hope for a tank replacement?
I plan on trying to get through Leningrad this weekend and will give you guys an update on Monday.
Hopefully.
Thanks so much for the feedback.
I really really love this game if you couldn't tell.
Happy Easter!!

Ok update after weekend winning in Leningrad scenario.

First off take the caution of not invading Leningrad seriously. I started to and almost lost all my units that got even close to the city. DUMB!

I won the scenario with a round to spare only losing my new anti tank unit.
(Yes I did not gaurd it properly.)

I am set to start Vyazma in almost exactly the same position I was in prior to Leningrad. 2000 prestige after upgrading and elite replacing all my units. Now I will probably spend another 1000 overstrengthening my units that I am bringing into play.

I am curious. Based on the thread people have indicated that I should get my 2nd hero in 1 unit around the 301 - 1000 mark. My ba se infantry unit with only a single hero with a +1 attack has around 800 kills to his name. Why no 2nd hero?

Anyone else having trouble acquiring that 2nd hero on a single unit?

Are heroes gauranteed, so if I reach 1000 kills I will have to get a 2nd hero, or is it completely random?

Thanks again for the interest and the comments.

If you are playing on Field Marshall, then i think you need to try and save a lot more prestige for 1942 and onwards. Because you really need to save up a lot in order to counter the often overwhelming Russian forces that hit you from that time.

My suggestion is to stop overstrengthing your units. Maybe just artillery and strat bombers. Everything else should be 10 or maybe 11.

For your SE units, if you want to be competitive late war, you should disband infantry and wait for tanks. Infantry is not needed. But if you have grown some attachment to them, then you can keep them just for the fun of it. Still, i would disband at least 2 of the SE units (disband 1 and wait until you get a tank before disbanding the other - as you can only get max 1 new SE unit per scenario).

Another great way to save prestige is to remove or reduce transport on your infantry units. A general rule of thumb is that if the infantry has MA3, then it doesnt need any transport.

One last thing regarding experience. Once your units get to near max experience, you should try leaving them out of the scenarios so that your other units can gain more experience.

Regarding your question about heroes, its random. So every kill he makes gives him a chance to get another hero. But as you say, once he hits the 1,000 mark, then he will automatically get one.

JimmyC wrote:If you are playing on Field Marshall, then i think you need to try and save a lot more prestige for 1942 and onwards. Because you really need to save up a lot in order to counter the often overwhelming Russian forces that hit you from that time.

My suggestion is to stop overstrengthing your units. Maybe just artillery and strat bombers. Everything else should be 10 or maybe 11.

For your SE units, if you want to be competitive late war, you should disband infantry and wait for tanks. Infantry is not needed. But if you have grown some attachment to them, then you can keep them just for the fun of it. Still, i would disband at least 2 of the SE units (disband 1 and wait until you get a tank before disbanding the other - as you can only get max 1 new SE unit per scenario).

Another great way to save prestige is to remove or reduce transport on your infantry units. A general rule of thumb is that if the infantry has MA3, then it doesnt need any transport.

One last thing regarding experience. Once your units get to near max experience, you should try leaving them out of the scenarios so that your other units can gain more experience.

Regarding your question about heroes, its random. So every kill he makes gives him a chance to get another hero. But as you say, once he hits the 1,000 mark, then he will automatically get one.

Thanks for your very pastoral advice.
I reallly do appreciate it.

I have already overstrengthened for Vyazma but still have a little over 1000 prestige.
I will stop overstrengthening after this battle and simply keep them where they are at or not above 11.

I may disband one se unit next battle but seeing as I have overstrengthened them I will save them as is.

I am curious and this is a general question so it shouldn't spoil the blind nature of my let's play.
The pre battle speech discussed rain and mud being a problem. So this makes me pretty confident this battle is going to be replete with rain and mud.

Are there any units that are especially gifted at moving through mud? What about units that fight well in the rain? Any help there would be greatly appreciated.

I have 3 pretty good paratroop units, but I was thinking of purchasing an additional 3 for this scenario since it is going to be so rainy. Do you think that is a wise idea?

Is there any other helpful advice that you could offer for fighting in the rain, because in my experience it pretty much just stinks?

Thanks again for the advice and interest in this topic, here is to Vyazma being my opportunity to get that much vaunted 2nd hero on a single unit, and may it be a good one.

I don't recall this scenario, but the effect of rain is to make initiative useless. So i suppose you should be focusing on high strength/low initiative units in your deployed force. Also, your artillery will be less effective, as all troops are granted a +3 defensive bonus vs artillery in the rain. And finally, your air forces cant do much when it rains (spotting is 0 and can't attack).

Halftracks and tanks are good in the mud. Trucks are useless except on roads.

So given the above, i suppose i would have a very small airforce and less AA than normal. Given that artillery is less effective, pionieres might be the way to go (ignore entrenchment). Still bring a lot of artillery though, as you will need more of it than normal to maintain effectiveness. And yes, the paratroops would also be good, but long-term you don't need paratroopers, so consider selling them at the end of the mission to regain their prestige cost (and only using green replacements on them during the mission).

So to chime in on the rain subject, I would say that rain, which will very possibly lead to mud, can be quite the problem. The mud slows you down quite a bit and burns up your tanks' fuel quickly. There should be some clear weather turns with dry ground somewhere along the way, so, you need to make the most of them. You should to try to move your units up to their full movement allowance during the clear/dry turns towards your objectives. This in turn will mean that you will need good reconnaissance - either through the air or otherwise.

I'm not a fan of using paratroops here. Let's say you get them out to some far flung objective & they take it. They'll then be out there alone & vulnerable to counter attacks. KV tanks are far more stout than some of the British & French tanks from 1940 and you may quickly find yourself in a very difficult spot. Since you've used paratroops before you probably know that their only help will be from Rudel & friends. However, if it's raining that turn that means that their only help will be no help. Your men may be forced to desperately try to hang on while your tanks slowly slog through the mud to their rescue...

As a last thought, what is the air transport capacity during this scenario? I honestly don't know. You can't drop the paratroops if the transport isn't there.

I've played this one a few times & it can be on the tricky side. Good luck!

Vyazma has a high probability of rain each turn and I have learnt that mud is bad in many ways - artillery effectiveness down, low movement, high fuel use, limited resupply, no airpower - yuck!

I think that the key is to plan for MV but be prepared to have a go for the DV if you get some well-timed decent weather.
Personally I reckon that Rudel is probably worth taking even if it only stops raining once every few turns, and you probably should take a fighter to keep him company, but more aircraft than that looks very optimistic.

My track record with paras varies between quite bad and truly awful, so I'd best not give advice other than to note that on the bright side your paras are invisible in the air while it is raining.