Slitherine

zoltan wrote:Darn unda we have always played a la Phil.

Move ALL evaders (splitting any angles arising from all declared charges). Move in order of highest VMDs (fastest evaders move first).

Move ALL chargers in the order chosen by the active player.

I think that is how everyone (other than Graham) plays it except the VMD bit does no apply to who must move first.

hazelbark wrote:

zoltan wrote:Darn unda we have always played a la Phil.

Move ALL evaders (splitting any angles arising from all declared charges). Move in order of highest VMDs (fastest evaders move first).

Move ALL chargers in the order chosen by the active player.

I think that is how everyone (other than Graham) plays it except the VMD bit does no apply to who must move first.

So it's:

declare charges
move all evaders
roll all chargers' VMD
move all evaders who would be contacted by long VMDs
move all chargers

1. Declare all charges.
2. CMT for skirmishers or missile foot wishing to charge non-skirmishers.
3. CMT for shock troops wishing to avoid charging.
4. CMT for skirmishers not wishing to evade non-skirmishers.
5. Resolve cohesion tests for FRAGMENTED troops being charged. If they break: Resolve cohesion tests for seeing them break. Make their initial rout move.
6. Make interception charges.
7. Make evade moves.
(including VMD. Sequence is by owner of evading troops) Chargers have not yet rolled their VMD.
(now that evade moves are done. There may be revealed units within the normal charge zone that become targets and thus react by evading if allowed.)
8. Resolve cohesion tests for FRAGMENTED troops being charged as a result of intervening friends evading. If they
break: Resolve cohesion tests for seeing them break. Make their initial rout move.
9. Make charge moves.
(roll VMD for all chargers at this point)
*(The part that is IMO unclear is do you say this charger then roll the VMD and then declare the next moving. This is essentially Graham's point. If true it would apply to the evaders as well.)

if there is more than one charge the active player chooses the order in which they are actioned.

(note if as a result of a VMD a BG would contact a fresh enemy BG that has not yet been a target of the charge then it may choose to evade)
10. If Troops contacted by flank or rear charge (except non-skirmishers by skirmishers) drop 1 Cohesion level.
11. Resolve impact combats

The "usual" understanding is each component of the sequence of play occcurs across the table simulatenously. This is I think clearly stated in the rules regarding combat. ie you can't fight one battle force a CT that effects another before it rolls its combat dice.

So the point Graham makes is interesting and I had frankly not considered.

Is the

Make evade moves.

portion the part that across across the board simultaneously, or does each sub point within it occur simultaneously. And since we can't be perfectly simultaneous then we have to pick one before the other.

In combat sequence explictly does not matter.
The only adjudication is pursuit.

Consider

Reform battle groups and conform troops in close combat to enemy.

from the sequence of play. Does that mean you reform and conform one BG before going onto reform the next? I think everyone plays it you first conform the entire Board. Then you feed in the entire boarrd.

I see Graham's logic, but i think every other point of the game is played differently.

hazelbark wrote:1. Declare all charges.
2. CMT for skirmishers or missile foot wishing to charge non-skirmishers.
3. CMT for shock troops wishing to avoid charging.
4. CMT for skirmishers not wishing to evade non-skirmishers.
5. Resolve cohesion tests for FRAGMENTED troops being charged. If they break: Resolve cohesion tests for seeing them break. Make their initial rout move.
6. Make interception charges.
7. Make evade moves.
(including VMD. Sequence is by owner of evading troops) Chargers have not yet rolled their VMD.
(now that evade moves are done. There may be revealed units within the normal charge zone that become targets and thus react by evading if allowed.)
8. Resolve cohesion tests for FRAGMENTED troops being charged as a result of intervening friends evading. If they
break: Resolve cohesion tests for seeing them break. Make their initial rout move.
9. Make charge moves.
(roll VMD for all chargers at this point)
*(The part that is IMO unclear is do you say this charger then roll the VMD and then declare the next moving. This is essentially Graham's point. If true it would apply to the evaders as well.)

if there is more than one charge the active player chooses the order in which they are actioned.

(note if as a result of a VMD a BG would contact a fresh enemy BG that has not yet been a target of the charge then it may choose to evade)
10. If Troops contacted by flank or rear charge (except non-skirmishers by skirmishers) drop 1 Cohesion level.
11. Resolve impact combats

No charges can be physically moved until all potential evades have been resolved, so I would say: Yes, the charging player would need to roll VMDs of BGs whose charge path is now devoid of targets due to evades, before moving any chargers.

hazelbark wrote:The "usual" understanding is each component of the sequence of play occcurs across the table simulatenously. This is I think clearly stated in the rules regarding combat. ie you can't fight one battle force a CT that effects another before it rolls its combat dice.

So the point Graham makes is interesting and I had frankly not considered.

Is the

Make evade moves.

portion the part that across across the board simultaneously, or does each sub point within it occur simultaneously. And since we can't be perfectly simultaneous then we have to pick one before the other.

In combat sequence explictly does not matter.
The only adjudication is pursuit.

Consider

Reform battle groups and conform troops in close combat to enemy.

from the sequence of play. Does that mean you reform and conform one BG before going onto reform the next? I think everyone plays it you first conform the entire Board. Then you feed in the entire boarrd.

I see Graham's logic, but i think every other point of the game is played differently.

To be honest, I'm not really making that much of a point, or laying out a line of logic. I'm just quoting what the rules say. It rarely makes a difference in truth.

The only time I've seen it make a difference is when you are charging with two BGs at different angles at enemies likely to evade. The reason being that the first evader may get in the way of the second and cause problems. Or the first charger could block the second.