Slitherine

[/quote]Well I reran the battle, decided to go for the units across the river first and this time the AI sent the rest down en masse logically and they arrived before Arthur could deal with the first group, end result was a decisive defeat. ONLY good factor was that ONE of Arthurs archers units was holding off some 6 or so Javelin units of the enemy for a while !! My feeling is that maybe the infantry for Arthur is a bit light as they seem to get easily taken out whatever happens and only Arthurs cavalry can do any good.

John[/quote]

Ok, sounds like King Arthur needs some help. I will try and get Max to give me a go here and see how many it feels like he might need; one or two more spearmen sound right?

Did you try going after the Saxons first, and seeing if you could be them before the Picts make thier way across the river?

MAXIMVS wrote:Hey, these scenarios are coming faster than I can play them!

Hey, they were over a ten plus year period, Arthur has plenty of rest in between.

I had them all completed before the first one got posted, but wanted to try a few of the later ones a bit more before posting. Let me know when your ready for another whooping as Arthur!

omarquatar wrote:

Scar wrote:
I usually create bigger scenarios such as Zama and Rahpia, as I enjoy the bigger ones, and as you say there is more room for error.

i didn't mean error, i did mean bad dice
but how many warriors were in a war band? from 20 to 100? one surely could double the BGs in the tinier games

That sounds about right at times. While I was researching Arthur stuff, I read where one historian argued that an army might have been about 100 guys. I am not sure I beleive that, but when you think of the problems they would have had just feeding an army, it might make sense. Have you heard anything on the numbers in this era?

Ok, sounds like King Arthur needs some help. I will try and get Max to give me a go here and see how many it feels like he might need; one or two more spearmen sound right?

Did you try going after the Saxons first, and seeing if you could beat them before the Picts make thier way across the river?

That was the first tactic I followed and was doing pretty well BUT that was where the lack of infantry support ran out on me as in the battle the cavalry did well, got bogged down, the infantry arrived and had virtually no impact. Then one by one Arthurs forces started to rout and if they hadnt they would have been slaughtered when the Picts arrived in force. It was the lack of AI cohesion that allowed me to do as well as I did.

In the second attempt I went straight for the nearest enemy over the river and again the lack of impact of the infantry was resulting in only SOME headway but with this tactic, the enemy forces logically moved down on both sides of the River and the weakened Arthurs forces had no chance at all.

The correct tactic is to go for the saxons I am sure, but the foot troops take a while to get there and the cavalry cannot do it alone, So by the time Arthurs forces get to take on the saxons there is the danger of the Picts coming up behind and the lack of firepower for Arthur doesnt seem to allow him to make the kill and be ready for another onslaught. Would be worth trying with one or two more spearmen and MAYBE Arthurs army just a little closer to the Saxons to start the scenario for balance.

Black Water

Like john2412, the first time I played as Arthur I was beaten soundly. Re-played it as the Saxons and won. Next I re-played Arthur again, and like john, I went straight for the nearest Saxons over the stream and this time ended up winning without losing a breakpoint!!! (Due mainly to the cavalry I think, who were able to score rear hits on either flank and, after a fair bit of the usual melee, and receiving my fair share of 'D's and 'F's, all the Saxon units in contact finally routed through all the fast approaching re-enforcements sending them all off the map. Very lucky!

But, just in case you're thinking I'm a good general, read this -

Tryfrwyd

Played this as Arthur, lost to the AI.
OK, I thought, I play as the other side. Lost again to the AI!!!
'How can this be?' I thought.
Played again as the bad guys, and almost lost again!
How shameful
Maybe the AI has some secrets up it's sleeve!

Ok guys, ya'll convinced me, I will update Blackwater and give Arthur a bit more to even things out.

Max not sure what to do on Tryfrwyd, want to play me a game there, I will take either side!

Yes! Give me a minute or two to decide which side I want to lose with ...

PM sent ...

Scar wrote:Ok guys, ya'll convinced me, I will update Blackwater and give Arthur a bit more to even things out.

Max not sure what to do on Tryfrwyd, want to play me a game there, I will take either side!

Interesting as my second attempt tactics were absolutely the same as Max with wide sweeps to the rear with the cavalry BUT when they came in the first shock was good but THEN the Saxons just pushed them back and once again the infantry were not strong enough and once they weakened there was nothing left when the rest of the enemy arrived both sides of the River. I guess the AI knows when to roll good dice or bad ones <g>

I went back to my first tactics and to see what happened favoured the Britons by one step, waited for the whole line to arrive then went in with Cavalry and infantry, this time decimating the Saxon line North of Arthurs forces at the start who were all routed, turned back and then took on the forces who had crossed the river low down and come from the rear, and also decimated them. SO one step favouring makes the difference and may help you with balancing the scenario - which is GREAT fun to play.

I think Arthur's forces could do with a heavy mortar section in support.

john2412 wrote:

Scar wrote:Ok guys, ya'll convinced me, I will update Blackwater and give Arthur a bit more to even things out.

Max not sure what to do on Tryfrwyd, want to play me a game there, I will take either side!

Interesting as my second attempt tactics were absolutely the same as Max with wide sweeps to the rear with the cavalry BUT when they came in the first shock was good but THEN the Saxons just pushed them back and once again the infantry were not strong enough and once they weakened there was nothing left when the rest of the enemy arrived both sides of the River. I guess the AI knows when to roll good dice or bad ones <g>

I went back to my first tactics and to see what happened favoured the Britons by one step, waited for the whole line to arrive then went in with Cavalry and infantry, this time decimating the Saxon line North of Arthurs forces at the start who were all routed, turned back and then took on the forces who had crossed the river low down and come from the rear, and also decimated them. SO one step favouring makes the difference and may help you with balancing the scenario - which is GREAT fun to play.

Hi John:
Did you play that second go with the new updated Black Water? I gave Arthur 3 Shire Levies, and moved the cavalry up forward a bit. It seems now that it might be too much in Arthur's favor, if you wanted to try it out just let me know, I will take either side.

[quote} Hi John:
Did you play that second go with the new updated Black Water? I gave Arthur 3 Shire Levies, and moved the cavalry up forward a bit. It seems now that it might be too much in Arthur's favor, if you wanted to try it out just let me know, I will take either side.[/quote]

Scar

The second game was with the original Blackwater - I have downloaded today and played it with the revised version at BALANCED and had a good victory without any problems so on the surface what you did has balanced it or maybe overbalanced it. HOWEVER this time the Saxons did some very strange AI decisions again delaying the southern groups advance, and the northern group over the river did not get involved. Attacking the other Northern Group first the cavalry and initial forces did a very good job of holding the saxons and on the arrival of the rest of my forces easily defeated them. Then turned south and the new force level had little problem defeating the southern force as well. I think removing one new unit could work although TWO of them were uninvolved in the southern conflict, but they did all help with the northern battle. The AI and the dice rolls have a big part to play in this scenario - get them adverse and your in trouble, get them favourable and its not too difficult now.

John

john2412 wrote:[quote} Hi John:
Did you play that second go with the new updated Black Water? I gave Arthur 3 Shire Levies, and moved the cavalry up forward a bit. It seems now that it might be too much in Arthur's favor, if you wanted to try it out just let me know, I will take either side.

Scar

The second game was with the original Blackwater - I have downloaded today and played it with the revised version at BALANCED and had a good victory without any problems so on the surface what you did has balanced it or maybe overbalanced it. HOWEVER this time the Saxons did some very strange AI decisions again delaying the southern groups advance, and the northern group over the river did not get involved. Attacking the other Northern Group first the cavalry and initial forces did a very good job of holding the saxons and on the arrival of the rest of my forces easily defeated them. Then turned south and the new force level had little problem defeating the southern force as well. I think removing one new unit could work although TWO of them were uninvolved in the southern conflict, but they did all help with the northern battle. The AI and the dice rolls have a big part to play in this scenario - get them adverse and your in trouble, get them favourable and its not too difficult now.

John[/quote]

Thanks a bunch for the input. I am trying to go through them all against human opponents and making tweaks, as when I ran them against the AI I really had to stack things against Arthur to make it difficult for him. Also, it seems Tryfrwyd is going to need a tweak for Arthur, as I am getting absolutely stomped as Arthur by the evil Irish under Max's command. But I am hard headed, and will want to get soundly beaten one more time before making changes to that one.

Oh no!

I downloaded this 8 pack a couple nites ago and just got thru 7 They are a lot of fun. I liked the small, personal armies, felt like I was playing playing a mini campaign
Thanks for making them