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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 11:56 am
by batesmotel
For a bit more detail, it looks like an adjacent/with inspired commander gives a net +2 bonus for the combat cohesion test, others give a net +1. The on line help seems inaccurate for this since it lists a +1/+2 bonus for a commander within command range and an additional +1 for being adjacent.
Chris
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:30 pm
by iversonjm
Well, I guess I'll just be alone in sticking with my one leader solution. It hasn't failed for me yet, so maybe that's a good thing...
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:39 pm
by batesmotel
iversonjm wrote:Well, I guess I'll just be alone in sticking with my one leader solution. It hasn't failed for me yet, so maybe that's a good thing...
I'm with you there for my horse archer armies if I don't need allies.
Chris
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:59 pm
by TheGrayMouser
Hmm maybe I will ditch my 2 subs in my Early Armenian army , although not sure if those xtra light archers that I can purchase w the spare points will do any good ( I think i am a like 12(losses) and 2 wins with this army) Maybe the leader issue is w my leadership
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:24 pm
by iversonjm
TheGrayMouser wrote:Hmm maybe I will ditch my 2 subs in my Early Armenian army , although not sure if those xtra light archers that I can purchase w the spare points will do any good ( I think i am a like 12(losses) and 2 wins with this army)
Didn't I fight that army? If it is the one that I'm thinking of the problem was all of the undrilled MF. Its too light to fight, to unmaneuverable to run, and ends up just being...targets.
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:42 pm
by batesmotel
TheGrayMouser wrote:Hmm maybe I will ditch my 2 subs in my Early Armenian army , although not sure if those xtra light archers that I can purchase w the spare points will do any good ( I think i am a like 12(losses) and 2 wins with this army) Maybe the leader issue is w my leadership
If you're the late Armenians, I think you can get allies (Media-Attropene?) that will give you more cataphracts and horse archers.
Chris
Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:51 pm
by TheGrayMouser
iversonjm wrote:TheGrayMouser wrote:Hmm maybe I will ditch my 2 subs in my Early Armenian army , although not sure if those xtra light archers that I can purchase w the spare points will do any good ( I think i am a like 12(losses) and 2 wins with this army)
Didn't I fight that army? If it is the one that I'm thinking of the problem was all of the undrilled MF. Its too light to fight, to unmaneuverable to run, and ends up just being...targets.
You very well might have!
Its the early Armenians I field no allies allowed 400 pts
I max out the cats , 9 , had I believe 9-10 or so horse archers (also maxed)
the rest of the troops are an even mix of the only other 3 options medium archers, medium "javelinmen" who actually have light spears, and light foot archers/slingers
I have come pretty close to winning vs Pathians or ven Bosphorans but both these ofeten field phalanxes as well, they do horribly vs Hellenistic armies and even the one late Jewish army crushed me with almost 3x the # of breal points in medium foot, yikes....
Ironically the medium archers are the most effective but they die in droves after the ist impact round is over...
Its one of those armies i really should ditch but I keep trying...
Re: Leaders
Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 12:48 am
by arsan
batesmotel wrote:
Just played with this in Starter Army 3 with both sides run by me and with the details display up with extra details. (U and then H shortcuts).
The commander cohesion bonus correctly applies within his full command radius for cohesion tests from shooting, as is described in help.
The commander cohesion bonus is only applied to adjacent BGs and to the leader's for BGs for BGs taking cohesion tests while in combat.
I did not test cohesion tests for rallying/bolstering groups for cohesion but in this case the leader must also be adjacent to or with the BG for the bonus to apply according to the on line help.
Overall the best way to understand this is to take a scenario, run both sides yourself and turn on the display window. Some times details will scroll before you can read them but overall it does a good job of showing how the game is actually doing things.
Chris
Hi!
Interesting results!
So definitely it seems much of the cohesion test and leader bonus is completely messed up!
I will post at tech forum hoping someone at Hexwar or Slitherine chimes in, as it seems lately they don't follow discussions much or answer anything...
Cheers
Re: Leaders
Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:18 am
by rbodleyscott
arsan wrote:batesmotel wrote:
Just played with this in Starter Army 3 with both sides run by me and with the details display up with extra details. (U and then H shortcuts).
The commander cohesion bonus correctly applies within his full command radius for cohesion tests from shooting, as is described in help.
The commander cohesion bonus is only applied to adjacent BGs and to the leader's for BGs for BGs taking cohesion tests while in combat.
I did not test cohesion tests for rallying/bolstering groups for cohesion but in this case the leader must also be adjacent to or with the BG for the bonus to apply according to the on line help.
Overall the best way to understand this is to take a scenario, run both sides yourself and turn on the display window. Some times details will scroll before you can read them but overall it does a good job of showing how the game is actually doing things.
So definitely it seems much of the cohesion test and leader bonus is completely messed up!
Not messed up at all, I think. That is probably as similar as they can get the PC rules to the TT rules.
In the TT rules: Troops count a general in command range if taking a test from shooting. However, troops in close combat (whose attention is rather more tightly focused) only get the cohesion bonus for a general if he is actually with the unit. Troops can only be bolstered at all if the general is with the unit. So with smaller units, on a hex grid, the PC game seems to be getting as close to this as possible.
The issue is not with the program logic therefore, but with the documentation, which needs to make it clearer that the above is how it works.