Slitherine

It looks like the Stormbird mission is an air support only mission, so I would guess your ground forces stay in Russia the entire time.

Hoping for better fate for Rommel in ahistorical path. He deserved it.

Wagner0445 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 03, 2022 3:38 pm It seems like the Western stuff is on the ahistoric path. Which makes sense. Being successful in Russia while the western front completely collapses is unrealistic.

Hmm, from a narrative perspective "we as a player" make the diffrence. If we fight only in the east there is no reason that the westernfront wont collapse like it did in the historical outcome (ok maybe some more eastern troops can be used to repell te invasion). But we obviously will fight on the western front, so it makes sense that we as a player can atleast slow down the allied invasion.

im really really really waiting desperatly to play both pathes. But still 34 days we need preorder and early access pls

Bee1976 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:41 pm Hmm, from a narrative perspective "we as a player" make the diffrence. If we fight only in the east there is no reason that the westernfront wont collapse like it did in the historical outcome (ok maybe some more eastern troops can be used to repell te invasion).

That could make the difference! Its not just "some" troops, the main german army was fighting in the east. If you win there a lot of troops could fight in the west and the industry could focus on planes and anti-air instead of building tanks and stuff that gets wasted in the east.
On top of that germany would have more ressources (oil in the kaukasus) and the western allies could be forced to send more ressources to the russians or are even forced to build up the second front in the west earlier, when they are not well prepared.
Last but not least when the germans could win the war the leadership might have not been that stupid suspending good commanders all the time, because they did not win unwinnable fights.

But I agree with you in the point that I also want to take some influence in the west. I would have enjoyed an air only scenario, when you have to defend hamburg, or cologne against are massive air strike.

Normally 20 scenarios would not be enough for everything that was going on in 44. The difference maker will be the size of each one. 20ish epic battles are better than a bunch of smaller ones. We shall see.

Bee1976 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:41 pm Hmm, from a narrative perspective "we as a player" make the diffrence. If we fight only in the east there is no reason that the westernfront wont collapse like it did in the historical outcome (ok maybe some more eastern troops can be used to repell te invasion). But we obviously will fight on the western front, so it makes sense that we as a player can atleast slow down the allied invasion.

I meant that a collapsed western front makes winning in Russia unrealistic. It would be completely stupid to run around Persia while the allied troops are a few km away from Berlin.

!!!!Spoilers!!!

The western part seems to be extremely small and an airforce-only mission. A mission that has the minimal goal of taking back all British Normandy beaches(Juno, Sword, and Gold). So the ahistorical part will still be mostly eastern front with a single D-Day operation leading to D-Day failing and the allies not getting a strong foothold in western europe. So no collapsed western front.

Ah ok, sorry i have misunderstood that.

Of course you are right, fighting in Persia while the allied forces advance through western europe would be unrealistic. But i think there is a chance that the allies land in 44. Much slower, but i dont think we can collapse the complete invasion. maybe high commands plan in the ahistoric path is beat russia first then drive the allied forces out of europe again.
But thats speculation. If i remmeber correctly operation avalanche was successful in the ahistoric path aswell. so there are allied forces are in italy in 44.

But im not sure. And thats my personal speculation.

I think with the success on east front the rebel faction will be much weaker. Many of them didn't against Hitler when Germany is winning the war. They joined the rebel faction when Germany is losing.

Soviet will be much weaker too. Without western aid Soviet even can not product the turret base ring of T34-85. Their air force will also lack high quality fuel. But we still se massive Soviet planes in the screenshot in the news.

With the oil from Caucasus German panzer force and Luftwaffe will be more active and mobile. And Germany is in general mobilization now. I hope we will have better ally force.

My biggest question in AO is: If we captured Moscow in 1941, will Hitler allow us to retreat? At least it is a shelter in winter and core of Soviet railway network.

Like the idea of the narrative scenario.

Wagner0445 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 12:31 am I meant that a collapsed western front makes winning in Russia unrealistic. It would be completely stupid to run around Persia while the allied troops are a few km away from Berlin.

Dont forget that the führer was making the decision. Calling this just stupid would be a very cute description.

Bee1976 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 1:14 am If i remmeber correctly operation avalanche was successful in the ahistoric path aswell. so there are allied forces are in italy in 44.

Yes that true. Manstein says something like they have to divert some troops to italy. But thats not that important, the allies never managed to at aleast conquer whole italy, or even cross the alps.

Like I already said in a topic that would be a perfect point in time to split your core and play all fronts in one campaign.

DefiantXYX wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 6:32 am But thats not that important, the allies never managed to at aleast conquer whole italy, or even cross the alps.

For the historic part this is true. But ahistoric, if overlord really failed, they might decide to send their troops to and through italy, because they already have a big and secure bridgehead there. And it seems that germany left africa in the ahistroic part aswell. So there is not much threat to their reinforcements.
That would open a lot of new possible battles on a complete new frontline.

But even ahistoric, the allies got way more troops/material than the german army. The just need to "land" their forces somewhere, so italy might be a choice if overlord failed/struggles.

32 days left

DefiantXYX wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 6:32 am Yes that true. Manstein says something like they have to divert some troops to italy. But thats not that important, the allies never managed to at aleast conquer whole italy, or even cross the alps.

The Italian front was indeed widely considered a waste of allied time and resources by many historians. Still, this seems to be a staple for the Western path DLC, so we will almost for sure return there at one point if the other branch is ever released.

wecker wrote: ↑Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:00 pm But Caen and Normandy? No good.

Don't be too hasty there friend. Germany has some surprises up it's sleeves for the Allies this DLC.

Stormbird is one of Me262's nickname.

The dev diary mentioned "Though ultimately unsuccessful, the seeds of changing your campaign destiny were first sown way back in the 1940 DLC. Events revolving around the capture of British Jet Fighter blueprints have been showing up ever since, including the potential early arrival of the Me262 Jet Fighter in Axis Operations 1943."

That become very clear: Due to the blueprints we captured, Germany has more Me262 in a much early time. That could change the air superiority of the west. In that scenario we use Me262 to regain air superiority and wipe out the landed ally force and fire support navy.

We can see a 25str Spitfire and multiple Me262 from the screenshot.

anyone know if there will be any Air War only scenarios in the West? maybe trying to protect a crucial prototype plant, design lab, etc. or a Para/special forces mission to rescue a captured General. Hero, Etc.?

scorehouse wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 8:07 pm anyone know if there will be any Air War only scenarios in the West? maybe trying to protect a crucial prototype plant, design lab, etc. or a Para/special forces mission to rescue a captured General. Hero, Etc.?

all who know signed an NDA. so rejoice, u got 10 more days of excitement ahead of u.

sers,
Thomas

Grondel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 8:09 pm u got 10 more days of excitement ahead of u.

sers,
Thomas

Hehe, seems im not the only one who is counting the days

scorehouse wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 8:07 pm anyone know if there will be any Air War only scenarios in the West? maybe trying to protect a crucial prototype plant, design lab, etc. or a Para/special forces mission to rescue a captured General. Hero, Etc.?

From the preview stuff, it looks like there's an air-only for DDay

Tassadar wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 11:04 am

DefiantXYX wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 6:32 am Yes that true. Manstein says something like they have to divert some troops to italy. But thats not that important, the allies never managed to at aleast conquer whole italy, or even cross the alps.

The Italian front was indeed widely considered a waste of allied time and resources by many historians. Still, this seems to be a staple for the Western path DLC, so we will almost for sure return there at one point if the other branch is ever released.

I personally would love the Italian theater to be a continuation of a (mostly) historical North Africa campaign/DLC! This would involve withdrawing your core from Tunisia to Sicily instead of fighting to a mass surrender.

adiekmann wrote: ↑Mon Oct 31, 2022 7:29 am

Tassadar wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 11:04 am

DefiantXYX wrote: ↑Fri Oct 07, 2022 6:32 am Yes that true. Manstein says something like they have to divert some troops to italy. But thats not that important, the allies never managed to at aleast conquer whole italy, or even cross the alps.

The Italian front was indeed widely considered a waste of allied time and resources by many historians. Still, this seems to be a staple for the Western path DLC, so we will almost for sure return there at one point if the other branch is ever released.

I personally would love the Italian theater to be a continuation of a (mostly) historical North Africa campaign/DLC! This would involve withdrawing your core from Tunisia to Sicily instead of fighting to a mass surrender.

I'm quite curious how the team will approach it this time as well, hoping for a similar theater. In the first game Afrika Korps was a separate DLC, but then the GC West 1943 started rather awkwardly in 1943 with some filler missions due to not much happening in that part of Europe. Combining the two in Axis Operations to already start a dividing branch in 1941 would be an interesting way to do things. It meant it would probably branch out into historical/ahistorical routes as early as 1943, but I'm all in on that idea, even if this would mean each branch would be overall shorter than eastern front equivalents. Second Battle of El Alamein and Operation Torch are ideal ways to split the paths off - either the player will have the resources and optional objectives to put a stop to the landings, or they will have to struggle and got the entire way back through Italy. Fictional path could be the Middle East in 1943, followed up by different path to Causacus and even things like Sealion redone. The options are certainly there and with just 1945 left to go on the eastern path, it's not as far of a thing to consider as it may seem.