Slitherine

US Corps 44-45
(Testing it the hard way, so without using a pre-existing core force.)

I've played the first three scenarios. This campaign seems really awesome! Here are few comments:

01Omaha:
-> A red arrow is missing over "Louvières" , once checking the first primary objective (there are the 6 locations to capture, but only 5 red arrows). All the rest works fine.

A hell of a fight, good landing challenge.

02Pointe:
-> Name on map: "Cartigny-l'èpinay" -> "Cartigny-l'Épinay"
-> Text for sec. obj. "cap. all 5 objectives" -> 1 spec. point pr town captured: Write maybe "per" instead of "pr"...
-> Counter issue!
Capture all 3 obj.: at the beginning and for the first few turns, the counter shows 1/3 whereas the three locations starts clearly in German hands...
It stays a problem because later it shows 2/3 when a single objective flies the US flag... and with the capture of the second location, it's written 3/3 which triggers the victory (a minor one if the player isn't carefull enough)...
And by taking all these 3 main town (so 2 within the same turn), the counter stays at 3/3 (instead of showing 4/3... the virtual 1 + the 3 actual captured places).

As it is now, these poor Rangers have only a (very) small chance to survive...
And if they die, then the text for Major Victory (very nice with the picture, by the way!) may seem a little incoherent...

03Carentan:

Another great scenario, but it may be a little tough to handle the incoming of these 7 armoured units, plus, like this, it may give a little the impression that they "come out from nowhere", if I may say so...

Of course, we know that they should already start around the town or that they should come at some point (thanks to the secondary objective of destroying 8 armoured units)...

-> I've made a little research:

Actually, it was the 17th SS Panzergrenadier Division "Götz von Berlichingen" which came to reinforce the German defenders of Carentan...

But on its way, it was deladey by transport shortages AND attacks by Allied aircrafts.

So, to stick even closer to the history, here are my suggestions:

1. It was known that they were coming thanks to the aircrafts that have attacked this column...
-> So, what about adding an event when they spawn or maybe just one or two turns before their actual spawning on the map (thanks to some "advanced recon", "advanced bombing" or something)?
Highlighting roughly the area where they are coming from, with few words about it, including the name of this division and about this double delaying factor...
As picture, maybe simply this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/17th_SS_P ... n_Logo.svg

2. It was an SS division...
-> So, what about really making them SS ?
It shouldn't be a problem anyway, because there are already few SS units (2 units of regular infantry) helping defending the town...
And then, just don't forget to check that the counter will count these 7 SS tanks AND the German armored unit (Marder III) present from the beginning, to avoid an (almost) immediate issue...
If this last point is somehow problematic, then maybe the Marder III could simply join as well the SS-ranks.

3. It had been attacked on its way towards Carentan...
-> So, what about making at least few of these tanks spawning NOT at completely full strengh?
The IA can partly replenish them later, of course, but at the cost of some RP - which won't be used elsewhere... This may as well be a little bonus for the player.

And, because it is known that the US 101st Airborne Division has played its role in the capture of this town, maybe a last suggestion related to this scenario:

What about either adding from the beginning two or three aux Paratroopers, already named and "airborned" in the East (I like paratroopers! ), or instead just increasing the player income when the SS tanks spawn (thus helping to replenish some of our units and allowing us to be a little better prepared for the incoming clash)?
(Anyway, extra RP is always welcome.)

Otherwise, no issue found within this one.

04Cotentin:

1. Name on map: "Saint-German-sur-Ay" -> "Saint-Germain-sur-Ay" (even if the Germans are there )...

2. Counter issue, the same than before (apparently): starts at 1/8 already, even if the Germans hold these 9 secondary capture points!

3. It seems to have another issue when the 3 German planes have to spawn... or maybe it's a problem with the event popup or the "unit is visible" trigger, I don't really know...
*******
05Cherbourg:

Well, there is again this issue with the counter, starting this time at 2/8 when not a single one of those is already ours... It may be the same thing throughout all the others scenarios of this campaign, it could be a good idea to check this directly.

Wonderful! I really like the side-story related to the V1 and how it's implemented.

Eh, just by curiosity, can they really be launched within this one?

ColonelY

Thanks for the feedback, added to my list.

This campaign is a conversion of the original PzC campaign.
This means I won't redesign the scenarios, but stick to fixing issues. There are a few (minor ?) enhancements added to many scenarios.

The V1s are mostly decor as the Japanese substitute unit is not very effective against land targets.

Erik2 Operation Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Agreement

Germany West 41-43 (v2.1), lvl3 difficulty, played out of my mod

01Belgrade

only minor suggestions:
- the briefing mentions Roman cavalry officers, but the units are both some Milita Police units
- the prim. obj. marker is missing the 6th VP -> Obrenovac
- disable the "purchase" option for the Romanian faction
- there's no flagged city hex on the map for the player, that means there's no deploy opportunity for new units available after the first turn

02Metaxas

- I would suggest to remove the obj. markers for bunkers/fortresses (and sec. VP hex markers). Those are usually never needed, and just spoil the "surprise"...
- there's no flagged city hex on the map for the player, that means there's no deploy opportunity for new units available after the first turn
- the sec. obj. to not lose more than two (other faction) units is set up wrong: text says to not lose more than two, the trigger fires at =2
- maybe add two more turns for convenience

Great scens so far!!!

EDIT: Could you please remove the naval commanders. They're not needed and just block access to the others.

The next 04Maleme scen's a mess basically, unless you follow a specific path. Bruce should take a look at that. And I mean it should be actually played and then reworked. And if my memory serves me well, the other two Crete scens were similar, very strange to play in comparison with the rest of the scens. A dozen of units and no supply anywhere unless you fulfill a specific task, you have no idea about beforehand...

- BTW, the sec. obj. in "Meleme" to capture all coastal guns doesn't work like that. I guess it counts all coastal batteries deployed, but as new coastal guns are spawned for the player, the counter never goes down and never validates.

07Syracuse

This scen is totally unbalanced in my opinion. Over two years have passed (06/41 -> 07/43!) and I've got no RPs to upgrade my units - and I have to upgrade EVERY SINGLE ONE of them to be able to compete with the enemy. And even then... a slaughter... no way to hold all the sec. VPs for even one turn. Impossible to hold for four turns. There may be some complicated "solution" to this scen, but I'm not interested in finding it. This scen is one I would suggest to play yourself for a change to see what I mean. Your balance is usually quite spot-on, but not here. Yeah, I've changed some stats with my mod, but surely not no that extent. Basically I was defeated after four turns. Very low on supply and no Italian income, very few core units to deploy and most Italians overrun, my airforce crippled. Sorry, but I skipped this one and going on with "Etna".

Thanks, Gabe (I think ).
I've started a new 'Germany West 1941-43' list.

Erik2 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:47 pm Thanks, Gabe (I think ).
I've started a new 'Germany West 1941-43' list.

LOL. But no hard feelings, right? You know I just say what I experience during play. And come on, my writing got nicer and much more courteous over the past few years, no?

It was like this: I was playing your German West 39-40 for the past months, and everything went just super smooth, only small, very minor issues at best. Started Germany West 41-43 a few days back, and the first scens (I think I even remembered them from the old GGC, right?) played fabulous, same as before. Then came the Crete scens, I remember them, too. If you know what to do, everything works okay.

For example in the Maleme scen, there are no supply hexes on the map except the primary VPs. And they're guarded like hell, no way I can take them with paras in three turns (as long as they have stash) and hold them additional three turns until the supply is active. But if I take the airfield first, some 100 supply will spawn the next turn on the map...
And there are like 12 deploy hexes on the map, in the north, all on water. The only deployment hexes available to me. Two destroyers and the rest are land units in transport ships. My beloved, experienced CORE units, ideally with commanders attached. ² And what happens around turn 4/5? A British battle group with two battleships, some cruisers and at least a half a dozen destroyers comes along to obliterate my most expensive and experienced CORE units in one to two turns... ³
Okay, at that moment I've restarted the scen, deployed no core forces at all, and won; I could live with that.

But then came the Syracuse scen. Like a blow into my gut. Hold secondary locations for four turns...the AI starts first and takes the first town without me being able to do anything about it. And that put me directly into under-supply, I think. Also the Italians were crushed like overripe apples. What was that? Some Yank "Über"-commanders or did you use some unlucky spec combination?
Frustration and anger, that was what I felt at that moment. "Why the hell doesn't the guy at least play some of his own creations himself", I was thinking...

Say, those Syracuse and the Etna scens were not part of the old GGC, were they? Sorry to say, but they still seem a bit raw and unbalanced, although it says it's version 2.1? I'll have to go look into the forum for other player's feedback on those. I just can't be that a bad player...

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2020 7:50 pm

Erik2 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:47 pm Thanks, Gabe (I think ).
I've started a new 'Germany West 1941-43' list.

LOL. But no hard feelings, right? You know I just say what I experience during play. And come on, my writing got nicer and much more courteous over the past few years, no?

It was like this: I was playing your German West 39-40 for the past months, and everything went just super smooth, only small, very minor issues at best. Started Germany West 41-43 a few days back, and the first scens (I think I even remembered them from the old GGC, right?) played fabulous, same as before. Then came the Crete scens, I remember them, too. If you know what to do, everything works okay.

For example in the Maleme scen, there are no supply hexes on the map except the primary VPs. And they're guarded like hell, no way I can take them with paras in three turns (as long as they have stash) and hold them additional three turns until the supply is active. But if I take the airfield first, some 100 supply will spawn the next turn on the map...
And there are like 12 deploy hexes on the map, in the north, all on water. The only deployment hexes available to me. Two destroyers and the rest are land units in transport ships. My beloved, experienced CORE units, ideally with commanders attached. ² And what happens around turn 4/5? A British battle group with two battleships, some cruisers and at least a half a dozen destroyers comes along to obliterate my most expensive and experienced CORE units in one to two turns... ³
Okay, at that moment I've restarted the scen, deployed no core forces at all, and won; I could live with that.

But then came the Syracuse scen. Like a blow into my gut. Hold secondary locations for four turns...the AI starts first and takes the first town without me being able to do anything about it. And that put me directly into under-supply, I think. Also the Italians were crushed like overripe apples. What was that? Some Yank "Über"-commanders or did you use some unlucky spec combination?
Frustration and anger, that was what I felt at that moment. "Why the hell doesn't the guy at least play some of his own creations himself", I was thinking...

Say, those Syracuse and the Etna scens were not part of the old GGC, were they? Sorry to say, but they still seem a bit raw and unbalanced, although it says it's version 2.1? I'll have to go look into the forum for other player's feedback on those. I just can't be that a bad player...

I haven't played Erik's Syracuse and Etna yet, but there were some painful Syracuse and Etna scenarios in the original Panzer Corps GGC that I don't remember being particularly balanced. That being said, I do think playtesting would be really valuable if he doesn't do it already, though I don't intend that to sound harsh.

Syracuse and Etna are original PzC scenarios.


As for internal play-testing. Unfortunately even my time is limited .
I decided early on to use this time creating a lot of campaigns rather than testing 2-3.
After all, the original PzC campaigns should be well-tested already.
At the end of the day I rely on player feedback and try to fix reported issues.
So, there it is.

Erik

Hi Erik,

Testing your work is the least we can do as a recognition for its excellence! Keep up!
Congrats.

For the most part play-testing is unnecessary, and I haven't played the scenarios he's mentioned yet so I can't say. Play-testing is something that should probably be reserved for when reports about balancing in a particular scenario pile up or can't easily be explained. For the most part, Panzer Corps did provide the balancing, it can just be screwed up a bit by the new mechanics in Order of Battle, like the supply issues he mentioned or requisition point income.

Erik, I hope my critique above wasn't too harsh, if so, I apologize. I know there's a fundamental difference in how we do things, similar to you and
Bruce. I guess that's why you make such a good team. I, for example, need my products to be perfect *before* release. On the other hand it makes
the produce slow, with only low quantity.

Back to the GerWest41-43 campaign:

As for the 07Syracuse scen, I think there's no other way than you play it for yourself. Some small changes, as I usually suggest, wouldn't do the thing here.
I don't have enough experience balancing scens and I just can't give you any sensible suggestions in this case. Maybe it's enough to reduce overall enemy strenght, or let them attack in waves, I don't know. But playing it was very frustrating. The units were mostly preplaced and my (few) experienced core German units could not help the Italians without too much risk of being exposed and destroyed themselves. Also I can't tell you how this scen played/worked in PanzerCorps, but it doesn't in OoB. Not without income, not like this. It's (only) my opinion, and that's all I'm gonna say about it. Let's move on.

As said, I skipped this scen after a few turns and started 08EtnaN. But...about the same unbalance here: endless reinforcement waves of fresh US troops with strong artillery and armour support with unlimited amount of income. Endless enemy repairs... with no additional RPs to repair my own troops and no income for the Italians. But they have like 95 land CP? No idea about PanzerCorps, but some mechanics must be substantially different for these scens to be playable.
Anyway, I "warbonded" myself about 1000-1500RP (for all factions), repaired my own and the Italian units and then it was somewhat playable. But still super hard as hell in my opinion and I did not manage to get even close to a raid on Troina (sec. obj.).
Also, you need to add about 40 supply for the player and the sec. obj. says "hold x turns".

Then I've played the 09EtnaS branch. I learned my lesson and added myself about 2000 RP at scen start and enough supply (you need approx. 50-60 for all land CP) with the editor.
Although, in retrospect, I don't know if really THAT much money was needed; but anyways, the scen played fine after that. Maybe partially because of a small supply exploit I've used on turn one. Still, don't get me wrong, it was not easy.


Seriously, all three were exceptionally hard defensive scens and require quite more feedback and balancing IMO. I'm gonna continue with the campaign tomorrow or so. A last turn impression of Etna South...

No problem, Gabe.
All feedback is welcome. We all have a common goal; an even better and more fun game.

Added to the list.

US Corps 42-43 Tebourba has it's secondary objective to destroy the Luftwaffe not triggering. I think some enemy aircraft may not be labeled as Luftwaffe units as the scenario started with saying there were 4 to shoot down, but I shot down 5 and saw no more on the entire map to shoot down.

CHXII1697

Thanks for reporting.
I've started a new 'US Corps 1942-43' list.

There's also a problem, though not a bug, with the Sbiba scenario in the same campaign that I've encountered. The secondary objective is to not lose any British units, but the Axis get first turn and destroy one on said turn. I've tried deploying an anti-tank unit in the single deployment tile adjacent to this unit, but for some reason it didn't activate when the British unit was attacked by enemy armor. Do armored anti-tank units not get affected by other armored anti-tank units adjacent to them? Or, since the british unit seems to be an anti-tank jeep, do anti-tank units not protect other ones? I'm pretty sure it's not the former. Either way, I'm not sure how you could fix this but you don't need to give it a full play-test to see what I mean. Just load up the scenario and let the first turn pass and you should see the problem. Maybe I should have left the deployment square behind it empty so the unit retreats that way, but that seems a bit much since there's only 3 that close to the front.

Edit: Removing the Unit behind it increases it's first-turn survival rate to about 25% so that objective can be achieved. However, the objective to capture the Axis supply base does not trigger. While the location has the silver marker, clicking the objective does not indicate the position.

CHXII1697 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 4:54 pm Do armored anti-tank units not get affected by other armored anti-tank units adjacent to them? Or, since the british unit seems to be an anti-tank jeep, do anti-tank units not protect other ones?

Quick answer: No, AT units do not support other AT units. Exception: "PAK Front" spec for the Germans.

CHXII1697 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:56 am US Corps 42-43 Tebourba has it's secondary objective to destroy the Luftwaffe not triggering. I think some enemy aircraft may not be labeled as Luftwaffe units as the scenario started with saying there were 4 to shoot down, but I shot down 5 and saw no more on the entire map to shoot down.

Same problem. But saw you will be addressing it, Erik.

GabeKnight wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:38 pm

CHXII1697 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 4:54 pm Do armored anti-tank units not get affected by other armored anti-tank units adjacent to them? Or, since the british unit seems to be an anti-tank jeep, do anti-tank units not protect other ones?

Quick answer: No, AT units do not support other AT units. Exception: "PAK Front" spec for the Germans.

Thanks
Then it would seem the best thing to do is to leave the space behind the british AT jeep empty so it can retreat backwards, increasing its chance of survival. I still think there should be a change so that there's more than a diceroll allowing the player to fulfill that objective.

In the US Corps 42 - 43 Campaign, Spring Wind scenario (Sidi Bou Zid), the counter for the primary objectives does not work.