Slitherine

Thanks for all the excellent tips!

Some of my tips for the Grand Campaign is;

1. Be aware of 'free' units. In 1939 in theory you get 2 Tac bombers, 1 free infantry and a tank. And an artillery if you capture it. There's also a fighter plane inbound in 1940 (Sedan), it is worth anticipating these units as you build your core forces. Why not spend the money on that 8.8 and get him some experience nice and early? Or perhaps a He 111H2 that should have plenty of time to bomb at its leisure and rack up immense amounts of exp ready for when you need the ammo sapping.

I found that buying Infantry and Tanks too early can cause the core forces to be too heavy in frontline troops, especially with the SE Infantry and Tanks that are thrown at you for free. In 1940 you can capture 4 tanks(!) which is a lot that early on.

2. Infantry are the bees knees, get them into good terrain and back them up with artillery and air support. SPAA are fantastic for quick-fire support for when you need to truck up the artillery. Tanks for me, shield the open terrain or overlap/punch through a weak point. They're not pound-for-pound epic massacre machines, often Infantry can get a better combat result against everything except other Tanks, *especially* if backed up with arty. It might be an experience thing but in 1939-early 1940 Infantry can post results of 7-0 or 7-1 compared to a tank's 4-0 or 5-2. Later on, Soviet armour is just a pain in the butt to get rid of with conventional tactics.

3. In theory, you don't need to buy tactical bombers or fighters - You get two TAC's for free early on (Rudel and Lendt) and Rudel will become uber in 1941. You get Bar in 1940 and you start with one Fighter as it is. In 1939 air opposition is minimal and Norway can be temperamental with the snow. In 1940 the air war kicks off, but in theory you have three fighter units (The starter fighter, Bar joins at Sedan and Lendt fights in a fighter/bomber). I found 1940 a good time to consider getting SPAA to join an 8.8 unit, especially as the Allies start throwing planes your way, this does two things; 1) It provides mobile, localised air cover. 2) It allows you to escort the bombers and often puts you in a strong position to consider whether to counter-attack or not in the next turn. The AI will take a risk at times, *especially* if they haven't spotted your AA units in the first place.

Someone on this forum posted a list of his 'core' to try and be somewhat historical, I find it a very interesting way to play here's what he was using;

2 x Infantry, 1 x Tank, 1 x "small" artillery (Max 15cm) (Four groups of these = main army)

Everything else is support units so;

0-2 Recon,
0-2 Heavy Artillery (17cm+)
0-2 Tank Destroyers (max one Panzerjager
0-2 Heavy AA (8.8's line)
0-2 Assault Guns (Stu42 or Brummbar)
0-2 Rocket Artillery (max of one of class)
0-2 SP AA (Max of one 7/1)
0-2 Heavy Tanks (Tigers)
0-2 Engineers
0-2 Paratroops
0-2 Mountain Troops

0-3 Fighters (Max 1 FW)
0-3 Tacticals
0-3 Strat Bombers (max 1 in class)

That method seems workable, it would probably have a hard time in the Soviet campaigns, but so far having a cap on the maximum units allowed often forces the player to pick unconventional options or units that they may never have thought of using before. If you get lucky with lots of SE Infantry units you can afford to expand on the 'optional' units and just use the SE units as the 'core' for the 'main army'. This is useful as they don't count towards the core cap, letting you field more extras.

Yeah, rather, to keep more freedom, it should cost more if you buy more than historically intended.
An army of only super-heavy tanks as complete roster is weird, but it is possible in PCorps. It should still be possible, but with far less units or bought experience...

I try to avoid buying tanks early because you get so many captured ones (plus the nice 38t in Poland). Also the early tanks are a bit rubbish. After playing Soviet Corps I rely more on ground troops and AA so my airforce is often very small, and as mentioned, there are a few good fighters awarded in game.

I usually I use a base formation of 4 infantry and two artillery (usually 105) as the base formation. Depending on which mod I'm playing infantry is typically two wehr, one gebirgsjager, engineer or MG34 and either a cavalry or kradschutzen for scouting. Tank units are often independent brigades of 2 to 4 tanks plus mobile artillery once Stugs become available. SE and captured units usually are an independent mixed unit. I find a divisional structure (whatever organisation I use) is particularly useful on bigger maps and almost essential for LoV or GTPG's large maps.

The Polish cavalry power is absolutely insane, but I also think it is reasonable.


*AI plays it very intelligently, Poland has a tradition of shock and mobile troops as long as they have been around. Even think about who saved Vienna from the Turks at the last moment in 1683.

*When you have as much infantry and sluggish terrain as in Poland (not The Don steppe) with plenty cavalry you can do what cavalry has always been good at -> concentrated shock attacks at the most opportune moment.

*Cavalry also slows down the Germans a lot by forcing any decent German commander of thinking twice before sending any armor into bad terrain.

On the contrary, one can see how incredibly dangerous it was to be in cavalry units. Every attack you do is mostly against rough terrain relying upon the pathetic close defense. When they take damage, they tend to be smothered too.

Finally, there also was also at least one cavalry vs. cavalry battle in this campaign, but mostly the German cavalry rejected cavalry challenges and withdrew if Polish one charged head on. Their tactical doctrine of cavalry had become more of hobilar type where they used it as mere transportation, while the poles still could charge. However, the story for Polish charging German tanks with lances is a made up/embellished story with no apparent evidence. It was most likely made up by Stalin to admonish the Polish army.

Not sure this unit upgrade table has been posted already but I had found it some time ago on Steam. I don't know who prepared it (ThvN?) but maybe other people find it useful as well...

German:
(right click and open in new tab for larger high resolution picture)

by turn4441:

Italian:



Russian:

Thanks for this nice little Christmas Present

2 little Things to mention

I have Seen a few Josef Stalin III albeit only as Enemy Units
But the Il-10 is completely new for me. May have to do with my groundbound approach though.

hurly wrote: ↑Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:35 pm Thanks for this nice little Christmas Present

2 little Things to mention

I have Seen a few Josef Stalin III albeit only as Enemy Units
But the Il-10 is completely new for me. May have to do with my groundbound approach though.

IS III exists, yes...
I just put the charts into tricks and tips, they were mentioned by proline here (and created by ThvN and turn4441?): http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 20#p761893

by turn4441:

UK:



US:

In addition, this xls sheet from turn4441 is also amazing:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 46#p693146

One reminder to be aware of regarding the xls sheet mentioned above is that I converted the availability dates of all units to a month/day/year format which is what I am more used to/comfortable with (and is also used in the 'timeline' page) from the day/month/year format that the game equipment file uses. Also, the charts only show month/year so if you are playing a scenario that is early in that month, a unit may not be available until later in the month and you would need to check the equipment file for specifics. It would be nice to have the actual available date but much to cumbersome.

hurly wrote: ↑Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:35 pm Thanks for this nice little Christmas Present

2 little Things to mention

I have Seen a few Josef Stalin III albeit only as Enemy Units
But the Il-10 is completely new for me. May have to do with my groundbound approach though.

As the charts are upgrade/unit availability paths, I did not include any player 'non-purchasable' units in any of them so folks wouldn't be confused when they weren't available to purchase a unit on a given date, so the IS-3 isn't shown in the Soviet chart. However, the in-game availability of such units is shown in the excel spreadsheet I made and listed as 'nopurchase' as they are listed in the equipment file.

turn4441 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:16 pm One reminder to be aware of regarding the xls sheet mentioned above is that I converted the availability dates of all units to a month/day/year format which is what I am more used to/comfortable with (and is also used in the 'timeline' page) from the day/month/year format that the game equipment file uses. Also, the charts only show month/year so if you are playing a scenario that is early in that month, a unit may not be available until later in the month and you would need to check the equipment file for specifics. It would be nice to have the actual available date but much to cumbersome.

Just linking the latest version of this masterpiece...
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 40#p769925

My tips from recently completed Wehrmact Campaign are:
No1 Go for Air superiority, you are going to need it big time. An ideal air force for the ultimate US invasion consists of: 6 fighters, 3 tactical, 3 level bombers! An ideal total of 12, if this is not possible go for 10 air units.
No2 go for Mobility. Tanks, Halftracks, Motorcycles, Recons, Mech artillery, in order to quick reach your objective.
No3 maximize prestige and experience in each battle. This means no need to achieve decisive in each battle.
No4 economize on your losses. Better lose 3 strength points on infantry, rather than on tanks and airplanes.
No5 use life saver units like the Flak 88. Average cost, saves your ass in the skies and on the ground. Pioneers are a good example also.
No6 use decoy tactics. AI attacks the most exposed and vulnerable units. Also, place an inferior unit close by a heavy fortified hex. Nice.. Enemy might exit the hex, to hit your unit.
No7 use prestige save tactics. Don’t go for a minor city objective, if during the process you lose more than 50 prestige points, not worth it.
No8 train on sea tactics. Three particular scenarios involve great sea landings. Use a screen of destroyers, followed by subs, than cruisers and heavy cruisers and finally your battleship. We do not have many Bismarck to lose.
No9 Train your paratroopers. Three of them can create havoc behind enemy lines.
No10 Use trains and Ju52 to fast transport units in order to quickly move around your units
No11 Gain the critical +1 movement. Think of your future Maus tank!
No12 buy cheap units, like paras, mottos etc to drop down your soft cup.
No13 soften up enemy entrenchment with your artillery and level bombers. Suppression can make miracles happen.

Lastly, enjoy the game

For the records,
My final core units’ composition in the Wehrmacht Campaign
At the start of the last scenario (US West), was as follows:

Bridge engineers x1
Paratroopers x2
Pioneers x5
Kradschutzen x2
Gebirgsjager x1

Tanks x7
Recon vehicle x1
Anti air Flak 88x2
Artillery x5

Fighters x6
Tactical Bombers x2
Level Strategic Bombers x2

On a whim, I started up the GC again. I lost my save when I moved on to a new computer way back when.

I just finished 1939, I was taking in some tips from here and elsewhere on the forums. Normally I disband the initial A/T unit, but this campaign I've decided to try and utilise it. I'm also trying to not get so hung up on decisive victories in later scenarios, because the Grand Campaign is really good in allowing 'marginals' to count as victories anyway, with the decisives only really influencing certain battles (thankfully).

So, at Poznan I checked the initial starting group and it was:

2x Infantry,
1x Mountaineers,
2x awful tanks
1x Fighter,
1x Tactical Bomber
1x Arty
1x Anti-tank
1x Recon

I think my initial three purchases were, an extra artillery, an extra recon and a Strategic bomber. I added an 8.8 AA to the core pretty quickly, I think at Lodz perhaps.

I must admit, having *two* recon units has pretty much changed things completely. I organised my units into battle groups: An infantry, Arty, Tank, Anti-Tank (or 88) and the group that goes without the 88 has the fighter for air cover. The campaign throws a lot of free units at you, so there's seldom a need to add to the core imo.

Anyway, two recons are a god-send, because suddenly I'm not charging into things blindly or taking risks. I tended to use just the one in the past, but now I can get very good coverage. More if I can use Recon Rudel, though I'm trying to babysit him for obvious reasons. (Had a heart attack when in one scenario he got ganked by an AA and two fighters and had to limp home at 2hp...)

My opinion might change when I get to Russia. I distinctly remember recon getting wiped out easily at that period of time, but I hope to champion their cause. We shall see.

Anti-tanks, the initial 3.7cm PAK is at full experience, I am actually surprised (or lucky) at how often I've manoeuvred it into a position so that enemy tanks end up 1 hex away the following turn, or even blindly charge into the space next to them when already deployed. It has already proven it's value in the many battles in 39, which has turned my opinion on the class so far. I'm hoping I get him some heroes and switch him to a mobile A/T in the future scenarios. I probably need to get another one of these in 1940... They were benched in Norway since the terrain and enemy forces didn't really warrant an A/T unit imo. (You can farm easy exp with them in Kampinoska Forest if you wheel them out against the trains there, or the Polish tanks in bad terrain, whatever.)

The 8.8 is amazing as an anti-tank, but I haven't had much success with it as an AA in terms of kills. It seems to get about 2-3 kills, and the Messser Bf109E is miles better, capable of hitting 7-8 in one attack. I'm thinking of adding either another 8.8 in the future or a mobile A/A, I'm just trying to remember when air becomes an issues in the GC.

Still, I think a massive reason why I'm exploiting the AT units strengths now is the fact that I have good eyes in the recon squads, which allows me to plan better.

I guess, TL:DR my point is, if you've had bad experiences with certain unpopular units like the A/T or recon, stick with them but change your tactical play up a bit to take advantage of their use. It helps if you can identify the 'why' you can't exploit them successfully. In my case, a lack of visibility and ergo a lack of planning (and luck).

Hopefully my opinion will remain this positive come GC 1944 East though!

RVallant wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:29 pm On a whim, I started up the GC again. I lost my save when I moved on to a new computer way back when.

I just finished 1939, I was taking in some tips from here and elsewhere on the forums. Normally I disband the initial A/T unit, but this campaign I've decided to try and utilise it. I'm also trying to not get so hung up on decisive victories in later scenarios, because the Grand Campaign is really good in allowing 'marginals' to count as victories anyway, with the decisives only really influencing certain battles (thankfully).

So, at Poznan I checked the initial starting group and it was:

2x Infantry,
1x Mountaineers,
2x awful tanks
1x Fighter,
1x Tactical Bomber
1x Arty
1x Anti-tank
1x Recon

I think my initial three purchases were, an extra artillery, an extra recon and a Strategic bomber. I added an 8.8 AA to the core pretty quickly, I think at Lodz perhaps.

I must admit, having *two* recon units has pretty much changed things completely. I organised my units into battle groups: An infantry, Arty, Tank, Anti-Tank (or 88) and the group that goes without the 88 has the fighter for air cover. The campaign throws a lot of free units at you, so there's seldom a need to add to the core imo.

Anyway, two recons are a god-send, because suddenly I'm not charging into things blindly or taking risks. I tended to use just the one in the past, but now I can get very good coverage. More if I can use Recon Rudel, though I'm trying to babysit him for obvious reasons. (Had a heart attack when in one scenario he got ganked by an AA and two fighters and had to limp home at 2hp...)

My opinion might change when I get to Russia. I distinctly remember recon getting wiped out easily at that period of time, but I hope to champion their cause. We shall see.

Anti-tanks, the initial 3.7cm PAK is at full experience, I am actually surprised (or lucky) at how often I've manoeuvred it into a position so that enemy tanks end up 1 hex away the following turn, or even blindly charge into the space next to them when already deployed. It has already proven it's value in the many battles in 39, which has turned my opinion on the class so far. I'm hoping I get him some heroes and switch him to a mobile A/T in the future scenarios. I probably need to get another one of these in 1940... They were benched in Norway since the terrain and enemy forces didn't really warrant an A/T unit imo. (You can farm easy exp with them in Kampinoska Forest if you wheel them out against the trains there, or the Polish tanks in bad terrain, whatever.)

The 8.8 is amazing as an anti-tank, but I haven't had much success with it as an AA in terms of kills. It seems to get about 2-3 kills, and the Messser Bf109E is miles better, capable of hitting 7-8 in one attack. I'm thinking of adding either another 8.8 in the future or a mobile A/A, I'm just trying to remember when air becomes an issues in the GC.

Still, I think a massive reason why I'm exploiting the AT units strengths now is the fact that I have good eyes in the recon squads, which allows me to plan better.

I guess, TL:DR my point is, if you've had bad experiences with certain unpopular units like the A/T or recon, stick with them but change your tactical play up a bit to take advantage of their use. It helps if you can identify the 'why' you can't exploit them successfully. In my case, a lack of visibility and ergo a lack of planning (and luck).

Hopefully my opinion will remain this positive come GC 1944 East though!

This would be a great write up in aar. I would start posting your thoughts there so maybe it gets more visuals than it would on this tag, but maybe I am wrong

goose_2 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2019 12:36 pm

RVallant wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:29 pm On a whim, I started up the GC again. I lost my save when I moved on to a new computer way back when.

I just finished 1939, I was taking in some tips from here and elsewhere on the forums. Normally I disband the initial A/T unit, but this campaign I've decided to try and utilise it. I'm also trying to not get so hung up on decisive victories in later scenarios, because the Grand Campaign is really good in allowing 'marginals' to count as victories anyway, with the decisives only really influencing certain battles (thankfully).

So, at Poznan I checked the initial starting group and it was:

2x Infantry,
1x Mountaineers,
2x awful tanks
1x Fighter,
1x Tactical Bomber
1x Arty
1x Anti-tank
1x Recon

I think my initial three purchases were, an extra artillery, an extra recon and a Strategic bomber. I added an 8.8 AA to the core pretty quickly, I think at Lodz perhaps.

I must admit, having *two* recon units has pretty much changed things completely. I organised my units into battle groups: An infantry, Arty, Tank, Anti-Tank (or 88) and the group that goes without the 88 has the fighter for air cover. The campaign throws a lot of free units at you, so there's seldom a need to add to the core imo.

Anyway, two recons are a god-send, because suddenly I'm not charging into things blindly or taking risks. I tended to use just the one in the past, but now I can get very good coverage. More if I can use Recon Rudel, though I'm trying to babysit him for obvious reasons. (Had a heart attack when in one scenario he got ganked by an AA and two fighters and had to limp home at 2hp...)

My opinion might change when I get to Russia. I distinctly remember recon getting wiped out easily at that period of time, but I hope to champion their cause. We shall see.

Anti-tanks, the initial 3.7cm PAK is at full experience, I am actually surprised (or lucky) at how often I've manoeuvred it into a position so that enemy tanks end up 1 hex away the following turn, or even blindly charge into the space next to them when already deployed. It has already proven it's value in the many battles in 39, which has turned my opinion on the class so far. I'm hoping I get him some heroes and switch him to a mobile A/T in the future scenarios. I probably need to get another one of these in 1940... They were benched in Norway since the terrain and enemy forces didn't really warrant an A/T unit imo. (You can farm easy exp with them in Kampinoska Forest if you wheel them out against the trains there, or the Polish tanks in bad terrain, whatever.)

The 8.8 is amazing as an anti-tank, but I haven't had much success with it as an AA in terms of kills. It seems to get about 2-3 kills, and the Messser Bf109E is miles better, capable of hitting 7-8 in one attack. I'm thinking of adding either another 8.8 in the future or a mobile A/A, I'm just trying to remember when air becomes an issues in the GC.

Still, I think a massive reason why I'm exploiting the AT units strengths now is the fact that I have good eyes in the recon squads, which allows me to plan better.

I guess, TL:DR my point is, if you've had bad experiences with certain unpopular units like the A/T or recon, stick with them but change your tactical play up a bit to take advantage of their use. It helps if you can identify the 'why' you can't exploit them successfully. In my case, a lack of visibility and ergo a lack of planning (and luck).

Hopefully my opinion will remain this positive come GC 1944 East though!

This would be a great write up in aar. I would start posting your thoughts there so maybe it gets more visuals than it would on this tag, but maybe I am wrong

Ah, I've don't think I've ever written one and would have no idea where to start.

RVallant wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 8:19 pm

goose_2 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2019 12:36 pm

RVallant wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:29 pm On a whim, I started up the GC again. I lost my save when I moved on to a new computer way back when.

I just finished 1939, I was taking in some tips from here and elsewhere on the forums. Normally I disband the initial A/T unit, but this campaign I've decided to try and utilise it. I'm also trying to not get so hung up on decisive victories in later scenarios, because the Grand Campaign is really good in allowing 'marginals' to count as victories anyway, with the decisives only really influencing certain battles (thankfully).

So, at Poznan I checked the initial starting group and it was:

2x Infantry,
1x Mountaineers,
2x awful tanks
1x Fighter,
1x Tactical Bomber
1x Arty
1x Anti-tank
1x Recon

I think my initial three purchases were, an extra artillery, an extra recon and a Strategic bomber. I added an 8.8 AA to the core pretty quickly, I think at Lodz perhaps.

I must admit, having *two* recon units has pretty much changed things completely. I organised my units into battle groups: An infantry, Arty, Tank, Anti-Tank (or 88) and the group that goes without the 88 has the fighter for air cover. The campaign throws a lot of free units at you, so there's seldom a need to add to the core imo.

Anyway, two recons are a god-send, because suddenly I'm not charging into things blindly or taking risks. I tended to use just the one in the past, but now I can get very good coverage. More if I can use Recon Rudel, though I'm trying to babysit him for obvious reasons. (Had a heart attack when in one scenario he got ganked by an AA and two fighters and had to limp home at 2hp...)

My opinion might change when I get to Russia. I distinctly remember recon getting wiped out easily at that period of time, but I hope to champion their cause. We shall see.

Anti-tanks, the initial 3.7cm PAK is at full experience, I am actually surprised (or lucky) at how often I've manoeuvred it into a position so that enemy tanks end up 1 hex away the following turn, or even blindly charge into the space next to them when already deployed. It has already proven it's value in the many battles in 39, which has turned my opinion on the class so far. I'm hoping I get him some heroes and switch him to a mobile A/T in the future scenarios. I probably need to get another one of these in 1940... They were benched in Norway since the terrain and enemy forces didn't really warrant an A/T unit imo. (You can farm easy exp with them in Kampinoska Forest if you wheel them out against the trains there, or the Polish tanks in bad terrain, whatever.)

The 8.8 is amazing as an anti-tank, but I haven't had much success with it as an AA in terms of kills. It seems to get about 2-3 kills, and the Messser Bf109E is miles better, capable of hitting 7-8 in one attack. I'm thinking of adding either another 8.8 in the future or a mobile A/A, I'm just trying to remember when air becomes an issues in the GC.

Still, I think a massive reason why I'm exploiting the AT units strengths now is the fact that I have good eyes in the recon squads, which allows me to plan better.

I guess, TL:DR my point is, if you've had bad experiences with certain unpopular units like the A/T or recon, stick with them but change your tactical play up a bit to take advantage of their use. It helps if you can identify the 'why' you can't exploit them successfully. In my case, a lack of visibility and ergo a lack of planning (and luck).

Hopefully my opinion will remain this positive come GC 1944 East though!

This would be a great write up in aar. I would start posting your thoughts there so maybe it gets more visuals than it would on this tag, but maybe I am wrong

Ah, I've don't think I've ever written one and would have no idea where to start.

Oh that's easy, just write what is happening/what happened and what you did and why and how you did it and maybe add a few screenshots here and there... very easy to start... the rest will come after a while...