Herfelt's thoughts and suggestions

[Herfelt]

Introduction and first games

I've played Alpha Centauri (SMAC/SMAX) an aweful lot, so I can't help relating this game and almost every aspect to SMAX. SMAX is in my opinion the best turn-based stategy game ever made, and I hope that Pandora will be come a worthy successor (a spiritual successor at least).
So far I've played 5 games. I started out on Easy with Togra University. The first game was basically used to learning the ropes and messing around. The next game, also on "Easy" and with Togra, I began fighting with the AIs. I deployed Goliath, Avenger Tanks and Planes and took out Vermillions capital and a few other cities.

The next game was on "Medium". I played as the Solar Dynasty (the equivalent of the Hive from SMAX, however Solar does not have the economical disadvantage Hive has). Solar is a powerhouse. The inceased production coupled with the increased growth is just insane. The inceased polution is easy to handle and is not really an issue. Solar is by far my favorite faction so far. I started on a continent with Noxium and Togra. I was messing around with the workshop and I equipped an Avenger Tank with the artillery weapon. The result was devastating against the AI. The colonial troopers were destroyed and I took down both Noxium and Togra within 20 turns after learning about artillery. After that I had secured the whole continent, 18 cities and a whooping income of 1200 credits/turn, which was enough to secure an economic victory at turn ~180.

Fourth game I played as Noxium on "Hard" with alien aggression on "Hard" as well. I did not finish this game, however the increased alien aggression really makes the early game a different experience. Galeths and devourers attack much earlier and early defense is top priority. I eventually managed to get 10 cities up and get ahead in tech.

Fifth and last game so far was as Divine Ascension on pangae, again on "Hard" with alien aggression on "Hard" as well. I teched towards tanks, steel/titanium armor and defensive structures fast and was able to get 4 cities up without losing any units to aliens except a colony trooper who was exploring. I discovered that the artillery weapon can be equipped by the watercrafts as well. I built a couple of barracuda battleships and sailed towards Noxium. I managed to take down 2 costal cities with my fleet (and take the cities with a Avenger Tank). The last 2 Noxium cities were taken down by orbital bombardment, 2 tanks and a plane. Dreadnought watercrafts were added to my fleet and the fleet sailed towards Togra. 3 costal cities were easily captured using the battleships and a defensive tank with a droppod. The last city was taken down using orbital bombardment and tanks. The Imperium was next in line. They had only founded 4 cities and lost one to Solar. I tested out a nuclear missile for the first time and destroyed a city completely, which was not expected. The last 2 cities fell shortly after to artillery tanks. I was really close to a millitary victory now: 85%, and with a combination of scans and nukes I took down the 5 largest Solar cities in a single turn and won the game. The nukes took out 2 size 18 cities, 1 size 17, 1 size 15 and 1 size 11.

Thoughts and suggestions

UI
The UI seems really nice and smooth. I really like the continue bottom!

Citizens
I really like the farmer-miner-worker-scientist system. It makes city specialization possible and makes more sense compared to reality: Even though a city is located in the desert, it can get food and materials from other cities. I would love to see a couple of new professions added: A merchant who generates credits (like 6 per merchant with less polution than the worker), a entertainer/artist who generates morale (like 1 or 2 per entertainer), a environmentalist/polution cleaner who decreases the amount of polution (like 3 per cleaner).

Trade and diplomacy
The diplomacy is lacking at the moment. The trading/research pacts are nice, but it would be nice to know the gain from the pacts before accepting them. I would like to see the possibility of trading food and materials for credits, loans (credits/turn for a lump sum of credits), technology trading and the possibility of bribing the AI into attacking other AIs.
A planetary counsil would be a nice addition as well. Global resolutions could be something like 50% more research from research pacts, 50% more from trading pacts, 25%/50% increased army maintenance, banning nukes and so on.

Map
At first it was a little weird that there are no north/south poles, however I think it is working really nice. I would like some more map options though. Rivers would be a nice addition as well. I like the different special landmarks/tiles, which makes city-placement more important.

Social engineering/policies
Or rather the lack of social engineering/policies. The 6 factions are already quite different, however more customization of the society can be added using social engineering/policies/civics. The system in SMAX is brilliant and possible the best in any civ game, and a similar system in Pandora would be a nice addition.

Units
In my second game I used the Goliath, however I haven't used it since them. The lack of speed and droppods makes it only useful for one thing: Defending, but it is really good at that, if it doesn't have to defend more than one location.

In my third game I discovered the power of artillery, or rather the overpowerness of artillery. In my opinion artillery is way to strong at the moment. A nerf is needed. Artillery can also be used on watercrafts which makes costal cities extremely vulnerable, since they can be taken down quickly by ships.

Planes needs to be redesigned in my opinion. 4 movement and unlimited fuel does not make any sense, and I would rather see a 8 or 12 movement plane with fuel for 2 turns (1 turn for attacking and 1 turn to return to base) or 1 turn (attack and return to base in the same turn). The flak weapon should also be a requirement for attacking air units.

Operations
I really like the concept of operations. The cloning operation can really boost the growth of a city. The orbital bombardment is nice and kinda balanced. Against weak units (troopers) it is extremely deadly. The scan is nice as well and the same goes for the field operation. I also like the fact that operations can be used to prepare a war by stacking orbital bombardments, scans, droppods, nukes and so on.

The nukes are WAY too powerful. A single nuke can take down a city and all units on that tile.

Global wonders/secret projects
One thing missing is wonders; powerful, large projects and buildings which only can be built by one faction.

Terraforming
The formers now are okay, however they lack some of the more futuristic improvements like in SMAX: Condensers, raise/lower terrain, drill for aquifier. A seaformer is missing as well (I mean come on! Its the future! Of course we can harvest kelp and dig for minerals in the sea).

Seabases
Seabases would be a nice improvement. As mentioned above it is the future, and humans will fill all available space, and if the technology is present, the sea will be populated as well.

That is all for now. I will keep playing as I really like the game so far. I hope my suggestions will be considered.

[Sabratha]

I'd like to second the sea harvesting and terraforming suggestions.

[Monaldinio]

I like herfelts ideas!
As a civ4 modder with my mod "conflict on chiron" i realized most of his ideas, but my english is so bad, i would never
explain my ideas/things i have done in my mod like herfelts did.
Starting by terraforming over improvements like condensators, sozial politics, Secret projects, unique units and so on...

[Delta66]

There is a 'Terraforming' tech in the third (golden) tier. However I'm not sure it can turn water to earth. but you can turn toundra to plain for example or also degrad a terrain.

[gfurst]

Social engineering/policies
Or rather the lack of social engineering/policies. The 6 factions are already quite different, however more customization of the society can be added using social engineering/policies/civics. The system in SMAX is brilliant and possible the best in any civ game, and a similar system in Pandora would be a nice addition.

Hey there, I did play SMAC as well, and it is regarded as one of the best games ever for me too.
It was so long ago that I can't actually remember this civics/policies from SMAC. Instead I remember more from the Alpha Centauri mod for Civ4.
How were those policies and mechanics?

[Monaldinio]

SMAC Social politics and how they work...

http://sidmeiersalphacentauri.wikia.com ... ngineering

[Herfelt]

Social engineering/policies
Or rather the lack of social engineering/policies. The 6 factions are already quite different, however more customization of the society can be added using social engineering/policies/civics. The system in SMAX is brilliant and possible the best in any civ game, and a similar system in Pandora would be a nice addition.

Hey there, I did play SMAC as well, and it is regarded as one of the best games ever for me too.
It was so long ago that I can't actually remember this civics/policies from SMAC. Instead I remember more from the Alpha Centauri mod for Civ4.
How were those policies and mechanics?

You could pick politics: Police state, democracy or fundamentalism, economics: Free market, planned or green, values: Power, knowledge or wealth, and finally future society: Cybernetic, eudaimonic or thought control.

Each pick came with positive modifies and negative modifies, for example democracy gives +2 growth, +2 efficiency and -2 support. Each faction have a policy which they can not pick, for example Hive and democracy. A faction like the Hive is destined for a industrial superpower with little economic and political freedom, however Hive can pick free market and wealth to increase the economic freedom, increase the income and research. It would be nice to have such possibilities in this game as it lets you design your own society.

[Sabratha]

I was about to suggest something along those lines, thinking more about how "national ideas" are featured in Victoria 2 for example. But generally its worthwhile to look at how political decisions and faction values can grow and evolve in the game.

[morleron1225]

I agree with most of Herfelt's thoughts. There is one major change I'd like to see with the UI: please make it possible to put a group of units together and have them stay together from turn to turn - a "stack" in old wargaming terms. The stack moves at the rate of the slowest member and can be broken up voluntarily by clicking on the unit(s) to be left behind, etc. I find it cumbersome to put together, for instance, a large fleet to go after the Leviathans and whatever the large animated island things are called, and have to CTRL-click every time to keep the stack together and then make sure I don't mis-count hexes and leave part of the fleet hanging out by itself. Since I tend to have at least a few air units with the fleet this can become especially tedious. Other than this one quibble I think the UI is well thought out. It's certainly intuitive enough, given the lack of a game manual at this point.

Just my $.02,
Ron