Concerns about combat and FoG II Integration

[Majick]

Hi,

I'n very much enjoying FoG Empires with FoG II. However, there seem to be some inconsistencies going on. So far I've experienced these issues:

1/ A battle where I have a serious advantage e.g. combat power 700 versus enemy 200. If I export to FOG II I often end up seriously outnumbered. The same battle fought in FoG Empires will nearly always give a much better result. I do understand the role that frontage plays, and also that sometimes a superior force could be outmaneuvred, but this happens a bit too often for my liking and the inconsistency between the FoG Empires battle and the FoG II battle is not good.

2/ In exported battles an enemy flanking force often appears a few turns in. I have never once had a friendly flanking force even when I had a significant numerical advantage in the region.

3/ Elephants usually perform pretty well in FoG II battles and tend to rout a couple of enemy infantry units before they become disrupted. If I let FoG Empires handle my army, in a battle of say my 700 to enemy 15 or 20 combat power, if the elephants get put in the front rank they are easily destroyed by pretty mediocre infantry units. It's tedious having to deploy and fight a FoG II battle just to avoid this happening.

The net result of these issues is that the only way to avoid battles becoming a complete lottery is to save before every battle and if the games give a screwy result try the other option. Games that force me to cheat like this to get a reasonable result get tired quite quickly so I really do hope you are continually improving the combat mechanics and the interface with FoG II.

[Morbio]

I agree with most of this post. I never export to FoG and now I never buy elephants because they die far too easily and so aren't worth the cost.

[loki100]

1 - I solved this one by taking the option in FoG2 for armies to be inflated, I think you can go up to 50%. That seems to avoid the issue of a small elite army that can get swamped.

2 - is actually bad news, if I recall right, its really a penalty for the weaker commander to reflect some of their army appearing late. I've never seen anything but a guddle of light units appear so easy to hold off with some skirmishers or weaker MI till the main battle is resolved.

In general, leadership has a real impact on the translation system, if you are 1 pt down, you may end with a lot of second rate troops in terms of morale, if you are 2 down it can get rather scary (clearly your personal competence at FoG2 has a bearing here).

In general, I've found the adjustment for #1 has solved the problem of those occasional battles where the unit translation generates an unexpectedly poor position. It seems to add enough units to improve the performance of a small elite army

[rbodleyscott]

Also worth noting that if you have a small elite army against a huge army of crap, you need to follow Vegetius's advice and attack hard on one flank only and roll up the crap faster than their unengaged wing can outflank you.

It is fatal to advance into the middle of a wall of crap army - you will end up flanked on both sides.

[MARVIN_THE_ARVN]

Recently I have been exporting a lot of battles and I have experienced some of these issues. I think it will be quite difficult to sort out some of the battle issues where it converts.

I played Celticc (Northern Italy Galic tribes) and it was all going well until my 1-1 general met a roman 2-0 general with experienced legions, my troops converted down heavily and there were so many legions. Pretty much got steam rolled and that was the end of my tribe as the Romans wouldn't accept any treaty

Terrain does make a massive difference between the games, FOG2 battles are far easier in difficult terrain and you can compensate for a poor general with better tactics. Fighting in empires is a nightmare when you only have 0-0, 0-1, 1-1 generals versus 2's.

What sometimes gets me is the power difference between the provincial units, Dacian heavy infantry seem to be a case in that in Empires they are very good in hills etc but in FO2 they seem little better than heavy infantry during a hill battle.

Anyway, mad ramblings over.

[Majick]

Thanks for all the responses! I'm glad it's not just me. I think on my next play through I will roleplay it and command my first army personally, playing out in FoG II, and let all the other armies use the Empires combat.

To the devs, despite these issues you've produced something really special here..

[MARVIN_THE_ARVN]

Majick,

I found that to be a great way to play, pick a general, fight out all of their battles and auto the rest.

When they die pick another general or call it a game and try another play through.

[ess1]

When watching several of the excellent videos I am disappointed when, to progress, player transfers to FOG2 for an advantage.
I play MP where I find that the AI is quite strong, hence the player transfers are only confirming my thoughts on AI battles.

Mind you I'm only learning, honest.